Unpopular Opinions You Hold

[Guest ttfn]

1 hour ago, Sampson said:

You’re judging ManUtd and Barcelona on todays standards though. They weren’t the megaclubs they are today back then or rather that was just when they were starting to become mega clubs. ManUtd we’re still seen as a club of the 60s and Liverpool and Arsenal were very much seen as the biggest clubs in England at the time.

 

Easy to forget that Barcelona had never won a European Cup until that 1992 victory and that they were always seen as a bit of underachievers in the European circuit like Roma or Atletico Madrid today.

I’m not doing that at all, I could have not put the names in there at all (in fact Man United are totally irrelevant - even detrimental - to the point I’m making, the only reason I mentioned the name was because I thought using an English club as an example might be more relatable).

I’m pointing out that the 1991 edition of that competition had both of the following year’s European Cup finalists and that season’s German champions in it - the relevant clubs here are Barcelona, Sampdoria and Kasierslautern, 2 of which are relative non-entities on the European scene today. Barcelona’s history to that point is irrelevant, they were demonstrably one of the best sides in Europe and they were playing in a competition some are suggesting was third rate when it wasn’t seen that way at the time, certainly not by the organisers who prioritised it over the UEFA Cup.

 

Comparing today’s European competitions to those of the past is pointless in any event, the group stages and expanded nature of European competitions today (as well as the increasing polarisation of the haves and have nots, especially those outside the “big 5” leagues) means they’re chalk and cheese - I just think that the CWC’s reputation has suffered from effectively being demoted from the start of the Champions League era. It certainly had a higher profile that the UECL has today, a competition that many papers only seem to have recognised exists in the last 2 days.

 

None of that is to say we should be turning our noses up at the UECL, I just think the comparison with the CWC as a “third-tier” European competition is wrong.

Edited 28 April 2022 by ttfn

[CosbehFox]

The bizarre part as well of the older European competitions is that the UEFA Cup was by far the hardest to win. Despite it's standing as the third competition. 

 

The European Cup and Cup Winners Cup had a lot of chuff until the latter stages. The UEFA Cup had a depth when you included the 2nd and 3rd teams of countries and it being a free draw. 

[CosbehFox]

15 minutes ago, ttfn said:

 

None of that is to say we should be turning our noses up at the UECL, I just think the comparison with the CWC as a “third-tier” European competition is wrong.

I think another factor which didn't help the CWC is that towards the end, it started being played on Thursday away from the other two tournaments which demeaned it slightly. The CL started to include 2nd and 3rd; this meant if one of those two teams won the Cup, then CWC entry would default to 4th or the cup runners-up. In the last edition of the CWC, England's entry was Newcastle United whom finished 13th. Alongside that Lazio (7th), Duisburg (8th), Mallorca (5th). It was the final two season where UEFA complete cheapened it 

[Guest ttfn]

6 minutes ago, Cardiff_Fox said:

I think another factor which didn't help the CWC is that towards the end, it started being played on Thursday away from the other two tournaments which demeaned it slightly. The CL started to include 2nd and 3rd; this meant if one of those two teams won the Cup, then CWC entry would default to 4th or the cup runners-up. In the last edition of the CWC, England's entry was Newcastle United whom finished 13th. Alongside that Lazio (7th), Duisburg (8th), Mallorca (5th). It was the final two season where UEFA complete cheapened it 

Exactly this, definitely spoiled its legacy.

[Nalis]

Think there would be a point if we were playing teams of the quality of Randers the whole way through but we arent.

 

We best the 3rd best team in France and 2nd best in Netherlands and will play the 5th best team in Italy, the latter two being european regulars who dip in and out of the champions league.

[Sampson]

1 hour ago, Nalis said:

Think there would be a point if we were playing teams of the quality of Randers the whole way through but we arent.

 

We best the 3rd best team in France and 2nd best in Netherlands and will play the 5th best team in Italy, the latter two being european regulars who dip in and out of the champions league.

I'd argue the final 4 of the Conference League is stronger than the final 4 of the Europa League this season.

I'd back all of the 4 Conference League semi-finalists to beat Rangers and Eintracht Frankfurt.

[Corky]

With the way the Champions League is going with the awful legacy places, hopefully the Europa League and Conference get stronger. There are still some good teams in these competitions and from what we've seen all are taking it seriously.

 

I know we've benefitted from it this season but I hope that the demotion of clubs from one trophy to another stops in the future. Make it stand alone.

[Stadt]

7 hours ago, bovril said:

We all tend to view football in the past as more iconic and special than it really was. The quality and history of the final four in this UECL is obvious and we are arguably one of the best teams in the last few years in possibly the best European league. Let's not sell ourselves short as we often do. 

Our fans undersell that we are actually a bit of a behemoth now, at least compared to 98% of clubs in Europe. We're one of the 20th richest clubs in the world, we've won two major  trophies in the last 6 years in the most difficult league in the world. Clubs with 50-75% of our budget are understandably frightened by that (I just wish we could match their perception).

[bovril]

At the end of the day it's a semi final against Roma. How is it not one of the biggest nights in the club's history? 

[Stadt]

1 minute ago, bovril said:

At the end of the day it's a semi final against Roma. How is it not one of the biggest nights in the club's history? 

There's often the opposite of recency bias (history bias? nostalgia bias?) when it comes to football. Seemingly everything was better than back in the day. De Bruyne is one of the best PL midfielders ever but you'd have a sizeable group of people vehemently disagreeing because Scholes/Gerrard/Lampard was better.

[bovril]

Just now, Stadt said:

There's often the opposite of recency bias (history bias? nostalgia bias?) when it comes to football. Seemingly everything was better than back in the day. De Bruyne is one of the best PL midfielders ever but you'd have a sizeable group of people vehemently disagreeing because Scholes/Gerrard/Lampard was better.

I think it's understandable because football when you're growing up means more. I find it very hard to accept that Liverpool vs City now is up there with the Arsenal v United battles when Ferguson and Wenger were at their peaks. 

[leicsmac]

2 minutes ago, Stadt said:

There's often the opposite of recency bias (history bias? nostalgia bias?) when it comes to football. Seemingly everything was better than back in the day. De Bruyne is one of the best PL midfielders ever but you'd have a sizeable group of people vehemently disagreeing because Scholes/Gerrard/Lampard was better.

...when it comes to a lot of other topics, too.

[Corky]

45 minutes ago, Stadt said:

There's often the opposite of recency bias (history bias? nostalgia bias?) when it comes to football. Seemingly everything was better than back in the day. De Bruyne is one of the best PL midfielders ever but you'd have a sizeable group of people vehemently disagreeing because Scholes/Gerrard/Lampard was better.

Also much easier to view things that have happened as opposed to while they are happening. I saw a bit of Man Utd v Arsenal from 2002 on Premier League Classics a few weeks ago- watched 10 minutes and there was about two minutes of football played when they weren't hacking, fouling, spoiling and squaring up to each other. If Atletico were involved the commentators would be castigating those involved, it was that fractured.

 

The Liverpool v Man City rivalry might not have animosity or history but the quality of the matches is far superior.

[RumbleFox]

I’m hindsight, 90s R&B was better than Britpop. 

[LiberalFox]

We've got a semi vs Roma and the prize for winning the comp is the same as the prize for winning the FA Cup. So I'd rate winning the UECL as similar to winning the FA Cup. 

[Nalis]

3 minutes ago, bovril said:

I think it's understandable because football when you're growing up means more. I find it very hard to accept that Liverpool vs City now is up there with the Arsenal v United battles when Ferguson and Wenger were at their peaks. 

I'm on my 30s and there's a 22 year old in our team.

 

I think Sheffield Wednesday are an established top flight team, he thinks Stoke and Bournemouth(!) are.

[Izzy]

7 minutes ago, LiberalFox said:

We've got a semi vs Roma and the prize for winning the comp is the same as the prize for winning the FA Cup. So I'd rate winning the UECL as similar to winning the FA Cup. 

The prize for winning the comp is also the same as finishing 5th in the PL.

 

Remember how pissed off everyone was the last two seasons where we threw 4th away both times and 'only' qualified for the Europa League?

 

Now we're jizzy our pants at the prospect of winning the conference in order to qualify for the Europa League.

 

Great innit 

[Dahnsouff]

Inaugural

 

Want that.

[Corky]

You can never win too many trophies.

[brucey]

3 minutes ago, Izzy said:

The prize for winning the comp is also the same as finishing 5th in the PL.

 

Remember how pissed off everyone was the last two seasons where we threw 4th away both times and 'only' qualified for the Europa League?

 

Now we're jizzy our pants at the prospect of winning the conference in order to qualify for the Europa League.

 

Great innit 

Everyone's excited about the prospect of a trophy, you don't get a trophy for finishing 5th. Qualifying for the EL is not the desired prize here, in fact some might actually prefer to forfeit that part of the prize if it was possible. 

[kenny]

49 minutes ago, Izzy said:

The prize for winning the comp is also the same as finishing 5th in the PL.

 

Remember how pissed off everyone was the last two seasons where we threw 4th away both times and 'only' qualified for the Europa League?

 

Now we're jizzy our pants at the prospect of winning the conference in order to qualify for the Europa League.

 

Great innit 

That's cash on top of the league position.

 

So if you are a revenue league football fan, then it still makes sense to win this competition.

[tom27111]

This was...how do I put it?

 

Underwhelming.

 

 

[Kinowe Soorie]

I’ve always admired José Mourinho.

[Wymsey]

3 hours ago, Kinowe Soorie said:

I’ve always admired José Mourinho.

He's quite interesting as a person.

 

He normally interviews well, albeit some grudges against others, but seems to have a terrible attitude on the pitch (he should've been booked yesterday for going on the pitch on a few occasions yesterday).

 

Think his ego has got to him, now.

[RonnieTodger]

Andy Murray is hilarious