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Maguire to Man Utd / Man City

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Just now, Chrysalis said:

Precedent already got set when we caved in on mahrez.

Precedents can be changed - happens in English Law.  

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1 minute ago, Chrysalis said:

Precedent already got set when we caved in on mahrez.

I'm not sure we caved in.

 

Apparently there was an agreement with RM and Claudio and even then it took tantrums, strikes and airport stake outs to get his way.  He had to burn his bridges here to get away.  We didn't just fold.

 

For £65m I still think we got the better end of the deal.

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Ok we were slow to cave in and did resist for a couple of years but we did eventually cave :(

 

This story would have been killed dead if the club made an official statement hes not for sale for any" price this window.  They showed weakness by saying "bid more" instead, which kept it alive.

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34 minutes ago, jeffschlupp said:

If the club expect him to remain professional they don't have to drop their demands at all. It's a business, not a pre-school.

Yes it’s a business and any business owner will tell you whilst someone might be professional and turn up on time and do their work. If they are unmotivated, annoyed at not being allowed to move on to “better things” then sometimes they are better off out of there, because you won’t get the same performance.

 

 

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4 minutes ago, murphy said:

I'm not sure we caved in.

 

Apparently there was an agreement with RM and Claudio and even then it took tantrums, strikes and airport stake outs to get his way.  He had to burn his bridges here to get away.  We didn't just fold.

 

For £65m I still think we got the better end of the deal.

We received a club record fee for Mahrez, and it was at the time Man City's club record outlay for a player. And we kept him in the January window despite him throwing his toys out of the pram.

 

We are doing the right thing. If clubs want our players they have to pay a premium. We are no obligation whatsoever to sell to anyone. Man United are commercially one of the strongest clubs in world football and they can afford the fee. Good on Rudkin to tell them to pay up or get lost.

 

 

Edited by StriderHiryu
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Just now, Chrysalis said:

Ok we were slow to cave in and did resist for a couple of years but we did eventually cave :(

 

This story would have been killed dead if the club made an official statement hes not for sale for any" price this window.  They showed weakness by saying "bid more" instead, which kept it alive.

That’s because the club knew (and so did yanited and Man City) that the player WAS interested in a move 

 

the club made it publicly clear that we were not interested in a sale but I suspect that the fact we are considering a sale dates back to his contract renewal last year where I would imagine this ‘gentleman’s agreemwnt’ was made between Harry and Kuhn Vichai - ‘sign a five year improved deal and we will allow you to go if a club meets our valuation’ 

 

pretty much the same same scenario as Riyad 

 

 

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3 minutes ago, murphy said:

I'm not sure we caved in.

 

Apparently there was an agreement with RM and Claudio and even then it took tantrums, strikes and airport stake outs to get his way.  He had to burn his bridges here to get away.  We didn't just fold.

 

For £65m I still think we got the better end of the deal.

Dont know about that, it funded players and we have got some good players since he got sold which is good, but the amount we got seems way too low.  We also havent managed to fill the position he left with quality since he left and definitely for a while struggled to create goals after he left.  The wingers we been linked to now (who I think will never reach mahrez heights) are looking like they will cost 50m at a minimum.  So 15m cash for a downgrade.

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Just now, Walshy5 said:

Sorry I may get accused of living under a rock here but has anything official been confirmed?

It's exactly the same as it always was. We have a high fee set for HM because he's an important member of the team and we aren't really interested in cashing in for him. If MU or MC want to buy him, they will have to pay that fee. I guess all that has changed is a bit more concrete evidence that he would likely to move if the bid were to come in, but we wouldn't be having these discussions all this time if that weren't the case... 

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4 minutes ago, Babylon said:

Yes it’s a business and any business owner will tell you whilst someone might be professional and turn up on time and do their work. If they are unmotivated, annoyed at not being allowed to move on to “better things” then sometimes they are better off out of there, because you won’t get the same performance.

 

 

It's not in his interest to perform poorly though, because United wouldn't come back for him. For all the things that have been said about Riyad, he was denied a move and still ended up scoring 12 and assisting 10 in his last season for us - that kept Manchester City interested in him.

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8 minutes ago, Babylon said:

Yes it’s a business and any business owner will tell you whilst someone might be professional and turn up on time and do their work. If they are unmotivated, annoyed at not being allowed to move on to “better things” then sometimes they are better off out of there, because you won’t get the same performance.

 

 

That is true but these situations the motivation can be brought back and hence its temporary a lot of the time, also even if not temporary even with a hit on performance it can still be better than the alternatives.

 

If Harry was been so bad then I expect he wouldnt even be training with the first team.  If it got to the point where the manager thinks he is toxic, so training by himself, not eligible for games etc. then I would come around.

 

What we should do with harry in my opinion is down to rodgers judgement given he is the manager, he should be the one to decide if he wants harry for next season or not, not the owner, not the player.

 

If the stories are true that harry has told his teammates he would like to pursue the move, I think thats already been unprofessional, that kind of conversation should be between player and management only, certainly not to the press either.

Edited by Chrysalis
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1 minute ago, Chrysalis said:

That is true but these situations the motivation can be brought back and hence its temporary a lot of the time, also even if not temporary even with a hit on performance it can still be better than the alternatives.

 

If Harry was been so bad then I expect he wouldnt even be training with the first team.  If it got to the point where the manager thinks he is toxic, so training by himself, not eligible for games etc. then I would come around.

 

What we should do with harry in my opinion is down to rodgers judgement given he is the manager, he should be the one to decide if he wants harry for next season or not, not the owner, not the player.

Agree only those in the situation know the full story and agree Rodgers should make the call as he has to deal with the player and the other players.

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Evans, Soyuncu, Benkovic and Wes as club captain, is enough to deal with things until January, then re assess the situation. If we’re right up there (which I think we will be, even without Harry) then all good, and we’ll be able to attract whom ever we need

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1 minute ago, FoxinNotts said:

Evans, Soyuncu, Benkovic and Wes as club captain, is enough to deal with things until January, then re assess the situation. If we’re right up there (which I think we will be, even without Harry) then all good, and we’ll be able to attract whom ever we need

2 are a gamble, one is getting on so it probably isn’t. I guess the thinking is loan Soyuncu out and buy someone else.

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8 minutes ago, Babylon said:

Agree only those in the situation know the full story and agree Rodgers should make the call as he has to deal with the player and the other players.

Glad you agree, as think of the message it sends to the manager when he loses control of who stays and goes.  I think it was those kind of reasons which contributed to him leaving celtic.

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45 minutes ago, Steve Earle said:

The writing appears to be on the wall but I find myself strangely relaxed as to how it pans out.

 

I have complete confidence in the leadership & management of our club (not something I’ve been able to say often in the last 50 years). And I’ve no doubt that if they accept an offer for Harry we’ll have a better squad overall as a result - a bit like last summer when the sale of Mahrez saw not a direct replacement but sound investment in other positions which saw the club progress.

 

I’d love Harry to stay, but it won’t be the end of the world, or our top 6 dreams, if he goes.

This :appl:although if we spend £50m on Dunk then I’ll be a little uneasy about that. Maguire is a great player and a great professional, but there’s no way we (or any club) could turn down £80-90m. I believe in Soyuncu and hope Benkovic will be as good as he was at Celtic. I think long term we need a Wes Replacement, so it wouldn’t be a surprise to see us in the market for a centre half 

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29 minutes ago, Chrysalis said:

correct, assuming rodgers wants him to stay, what the manager wants comes before what the player wants in my opinion.  If the player thinks he should have the right to just move whenever he wants then he shouldnt be signing long contracts.

 

If then the player acts out during the season and isnt professional then the club would treat it as a transfer request and any loyalty bonuses would be forfeited.

What is best for the club comes before what the manager wants. Saying to potential players you cannot leave whatever means you will be less attractive to them. It’s balancing act I would agree, but it should not be overlooked.

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Again, if reports are correct about HM, and he has threw a hissy fit and his dollies out of the pram about going, just annoys me and I guess others, he is picked up from lowly Hull by a team that's not long won the premier,let's not forget, and 2 years down the line, well 18 months to be correct he wants to move on to "better" loyalty is gone. It's one way only. Players come and go as they please, but many like slim are content to sit on fat contracts being upheld by clubs. Also, it's not as if HM has helped us do anything in his time here. Suddenly he is too good for us.

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Don’t begrudge him for wanting to go. Fair play to him his rise has been meteoric and it’s a relatively short career. Not going to grieve him though If and when he does go, we’ll move on and progress we always do and always will. 

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