Coronavirus Thread

[Voll Blau]

2 hours ago, UniFox21 said:

Shocking, we've really ****ed this up. I sincerely hope lessons are learnt.

 

Really sinks in for me how many people that actually is when you realise Wembley is 90K seats. It's an astonishingly high number. 

 

However, I wonder what the actual total will be, as many people simply with covid upon examination are being put down as covid deaths. But this isn't fully the time for technicalities. 

The fact that lessons haven't been learnt is why we're in the state we are now.

[Julian Joachim Jr Shabadoo]

3 hours ago, Nick said:

Who’ll be running the public enquiry, G4S or Serco?

It's where the trade go 🎶

[RoboFox]

I can't believe the amount of denial I'm seeing on social media posts.

 

I rarely use Facebook, but I logged one this morning to see several popular news outlets talking running the "100k deaths from COVID" story. Under every single one there were saying "WITH, not OF" and nonsense about media manipulation, scams and fvcking Bill Gates. 

 

I mean, we know large swathes of the population are ignorant at best (see: Brexit) but I do really try to give them the benefit of the doubt.

 

How has it got this bad? I really struggle to comprehend the thought processes of these people.

[leicsmac]

17 minutes ago, RoboFox said:

I can't believe the amount of denial I'm seeing on social media posts.

 

I rarely use Facebook, but I logged one this morning to see several popular news outlets talking running the "100k deaths from COVID" story. Under every single one there were saying "WITH, not OF" and nonsense about media manipulation, scams and fvcking Bill Gates. 

 

I mean, we know large swathes of the population are ignorant at best (see: Brexit) but I do really try to give them the benefit of the doubt.

 

How has it got this bad? I really struggle to comprehend the thought processes of these people.

When some folks realised that information (or misinformation) could be weaponised for their own gain and social media gave them the tool to do it on a much bigger scale than ever before.

[Stivo]

30 minutes ago, RoboFox said:

I can't believe the amount of denial I'm seeing on social media posts.

 

I rarely use Facebook, but I logged one this morning to see several popular news outlets talking running the "100k deaths from COVID" story. Under every single one there were saying "WITH, not OF" and nonsense about media manipulation, scams and fvcking Bill Gates. 

 

I mean, we know large swathes of the population are ignorant at best (see: Brexit) but I do really try to give them the benefit of the doubt.

 

How has it got this bad? I really struggle to comprehend the thought processes of these people.

I think that in retrospect the introduction of the 28 day figure for the dashboard reporting was a mistake as it has enabled some of this nonsense to exist.

 

People react to/focus on a story on social media about a friend of a friend who died in a car crash after testing positive, and don’t bother to read or understand detailed posts from people like @Kopfkino who have demonstrated how tiny as a percentage any such cases will ever  be.
 

[Guest Kopfkino]

36 minutes ago, RoboFox said:

I can't believe the amount of denial I'm seeing on social media posts.

 

I rarely use Facebook, but I logged one this morning to see several popular news outlets talking running the "100k deaths from COVID" story. Under every single one there were saying "WITH, not OF" and nonsense about media manipulation, scams and fvcking Bill Gates. 

 

I mean, we know large swathes of the population are ignorant at best (see: Brexit) but I do really try to give them the benefit of the doubt.

 

How has it got this bad? I really struggle to comprehend the thought processes of these people.

Motivated reasoning explains a good portion. People want to believe things and particularly people want to believe things aren’t bad and that they have control. It’s much nicer to believe it isn’t bad and preferable to believe you have control. Believing something to be over-egged gives you control because a)you don’t have the face up to consequences of nature robbing us of control and b) you can be the ‘resistance’ and grab control by pushing back.

 

@leicsmac has covered people acting nefariously or for personal gain (Ivor Cummins has managed to crowdfund something like 150k to make a film about himself). But the reason they can do that is people want to believe these things, search them out and hang to their words for comfort. False positives was a classic example, it was far more pleasant at the time to believe that there wasn’t a problem coming and that trade-offs. As long as you ignored the assumptions made or chose the right inputs, you could use the absolutism of maths to believe nothing was happening and shit wasn’t about to hit the fan unless something was done. No choices to make, no trade-offs to face. Easy life.

 

It’s not that people are necessarily stupid or ignorant or anything, it’s that people want to believe things that are more comfortable. And it’s why they’ll label themselves sceptics, that sounds much nicer and more desirable than admitting they’ve succumbed to cranks. And once you’ve gone balls deep, the intellectual pain of reevaluating and changing course is too great so it perpetuates.

[Guest Col city fan]

3 hours ago, kingfox said:

Well, that’s what happens when we get shoved into lockdowns too late, then get taken out too early.

 

Border quarantine should have been in place at some point last year, bit late copying the likes of Australia on that front now.

 

The list could go on.

It’s also what happens when daft cvnts swan about like nothing is wrong. 
It all adds up, to I believe we now have the biggest death rate, per capita, in the world?

And this is Britain with its NHS...

We’ve done astoundingly badly 

[Guest Manini]

1 hour ago, RoboFox said:

I can't believe the amount of denial I'm seeing on social media posts.

 

I rarely use Facebook, but I logged one this morning to see several popular news outlets talking running the "100k deaths from COVID" story. Under every single one there were saying "WITH, not OF" and nonsense about media manipulation, scams and fvcking Bill Gates. 

 

I mean, we know large swathes of the population are ignorant at best (see: Brexit) but I do really try to give them the benefit of the doubt.

 

How has it got this bad? I really struggle to comprehend the thought processes of these people.

There’s a really really really ****ing infuriating video that’s doing the rounds on Twitter/SM at the minute of a bloke and some woman just barging in to an ICU ward with no suitable PPE demanding that this bloke with pneumonia is sent home because Covid apparently doesn’t exist, despite more than one doctor telling them that the man in question will die if he leaves the hospital. 
 

I’m sure you’ll come across it at some point. 

[Finnaldo]

13 hours ago, Kopfkino said:

Govt has seemingly decided hotel quarantine just for those come from ‘high-risk’ areas. I feel it’s going to be yet another mistake they’ll end up having to tighten because they refuse to make big decisions quickly without compromise.

It’ll be one of the few times you’ll get agreement across the aisle for strict border control, and yet we’re dithering again. For what? For who? If our whole vaccine rollout and hope for normality is scuppered by foreign mutations it’ll be on the government’s hands.

[RowlattsFox]

5 minutes ago, Finnaldo said:

It’ll be one of the few times you’ll get agreement across the aisle for strict border control, and yet we’re dithering again. For what? For who? If our whole vaccine rollout and hope for normality is scuppered by foreign mutations it’ll be on the government’s hands.

You're already seeing usual suspects moaning about potential quarantine hotels on social media and no doubt you'd see the inevitable "why are footballers and other sports people allowed to travel" 

 

I think they will eventually have quarantine hotels but there will be so many exceptions it will probably be got around by so many people. I'm still amazed how many people are still flying to the UK from all over the world, can't all be essential purposes surely. 

[dsr-burnley]

15 minutes ago, Finnaldo said:

It’ll be one of the few times you’ll get agreement across the aisle for strict border control, and yet we’re dithering again. For what? For who? If our whole vaccine rollout and hope for normality is scuppered by foreign mutations it’ll be on the government’s hands.

You don't get normality by banning foreign travel.  Foreign travel is normal.

 

If there are specific reasons to ban foreign travel in the very short term, then fine.  But to ban it forever, just in case there's a mutation?  It took 150 years to eradicate smallpox after the vaccine was discovered.  Are we are to wait until all coronaviruses have been eliminated, animal and human varieties, to be sure there will be no mutations?

[leicsmac]

2 minutes ago, dsr-burnley said:

You don't get normality by banning foreign travel.  Foreign travel is normal.

 

If there are specific reasons to ban foreign travel in the very short term, then fine.  But to ban it forever, just in case there's a mutation?  It took 150 years to eradicate smallpox after the vaccine was discovered.  Are we are to wait until all coronaviruses have been eliminated, animal and human varieties, to be sure there will be no mutations?

....was there anyone suggesting or even vaguely inferring that foreign travel should be banned for the long term here? Doesn't look like it.

[dsr-burnley]

21 minutes ago, leicsmac said:

....was there anyone suggesting or even vaguely inferring that foreign travel should be banned for the long term here? Doesn't look like it.

It has been more than vaguely inferred that foreign travel should be banned, or at least made impossible for all but the super-rich, until there is no danger of the coronavirus mutating.  Which means until the virus has been eliminated from the planet.  Which means, in practice, forever.

 

That's how Hancock is talking.  Whether anyone on here is thinking like Hancock or whether we all believe this overseas ban will be only short term, I don't know.  But we know that Europe won't be vaccinated by the end of this year so I don't doubt that these rules will only be extended, not eased.

Edited 27 January 2021 by dsr-burnley

[boots60]

The prime minister has told Britain that it f**ked up every key decision and strategy to battle Covid it was in its power to f**k up. 

Boris Johnson apologised to the nation for not f**king up even more, going on to list all of the f**k-ups in the last 10 months that have led us to 100,000 dead.

He said: “First of all locking down too late, our primary f**k-up which has cost so many lives and which I am proud to say we have now achieved three times.

“And though we’re a long way from those days we also f**ked up supplying PPE, obtaining ventilators, and opened Nightingale hospitals we couldn’t staff because we fired all the nurses.

“Lockdown compliance was forever f**ked up by my good friend Dom Cummings, and let’s not forget to give full credit to Dido Harding for f**king up test-and-trace.

“Once the first wave had passed we prepared for a second with Eat Out to Help Out, encouraging a return to work and sending students to university. So even when we weren’t f**king up, we were planning for f**k-ups in the future.

“And, in a series of recent f**k-ups that have put us right where we are, we opened all the shops, allowed Christmas mixing and sent kids back to school for one day. All in one month.

“If there are areas where this government has not yet f**ked up – for example, vaccines – all I can do is say that I am deeply sorry and please, give us time.”

[Buce]

2 minutes ago, boots60 said:

The prime minister has told Britain that it f**ked up every key decision and strategy to battle Covid it was in its power to f**k up. 

Boris Johnson apologised to the nation for not f**king up even more, going on to list all of the f**k-ups in the last 10 months that have led us to 100,000 dead.

He said: “First of all locking down too late, our primary f**k-up which has cost so many lives and which I am proud to say we have now achieved three times.

“And though we’re a long way from those days we also f**ked up supplying PPE, obtaining ventilators, and opened Nightingale hospitals we couldn’t staff because we fired all the nurses.

“Lockdown compliance was forever f**ked up by my good friend Dom Cummings, and let’s not forget to give full credit to Dido Harding for f**king up test-and-trace.

“Once the first wave had passed we prepared for a second with Eat Out to Help Out, encouraging a return to work and sending students to university. So even when we weren’t f**king up, we were planning for f**k-ups in the future.

“And, in a series of recent f**k-ups that have put us right where we are, we opened all the shops, allowed Christmas mixing and sent kids back to school for one day. All in one month.

“If there are areas where this government has not yet f**ked up – for example, vaccines – all I can do is say that I am deeply sorry and please, give us time.”

 

Yeah, but now's not the time to speak about it...

[leicsmac]

4 minutes ago, dsr-burnley said:

It has been more than vaguely inferred that foreign travel should be banned, or at least made impossible for all but the super-rich, until there is no danger of the coronavirus mutating.  Which means until the virus has been eliminated from the planet.  Which means, in practice, forever.

 

That's how Hancock is talking.  Whether anyone on here is thinking like Hancock or whether we all believe this overseas ban will be only short term, I don't know.  But we know that Europe won't be vaccinated by the end of this year so I don't doubt that these rules will only be extended, not eased.

I don't think anyone on here is thinking like Hancock, I don't think Hancock is thinking like Hancock based on that evidence and if he is then he's bloody daft because the simple and obvious idea is to suspend travel until cases and hospitalisations have gotten to a reasonable level through deployment of the vaccine (and yes, it does work on all mutations up to this point) and then open things up again. Pretty much every country that has restricted access to its borders during this (including the one I'm currently resident in) has the same idea.

[Dahnsouff]

10 minutes ago, Buce said:

 

Yeah, but now's not the time to speak about it...

Tell you what, lets pump loads of cash into getting a review done right now - think this is a super idea  

[Buce]

1 minute ago, Dahnsouff said:

Tell you what, lets pump loads of cash into getting a review done right now - think this is a super idea  

 

What price do you put on the thousands more who will die if his inadequate, pathetic response isn't challenged?

 

You know, just maybe, with enough pressure he might actually get his act together?

[Guest Harrydc]

Schools opening March 8th at the earliest...

 

Top 4 groups vaccinated mid February.. 

Edited 27 January 2021 by Harrydc

[Super_horns]

 

Will that satisfy both teachers and parents who might have have different concerns and priorities?

[Dahnsouff]

1 minute ago, Buce said:

 

What price do you put on the thousands more who will die if his inadequate, pathetic response isn't challenged?

 

You know, just maybe, with enough pressure he might actually get his act together?

There is no price, that was a typical self righteous response to a reasonable point. Investing now in such a review would hugely detract from vaccine rollout

 

When the air is clear, haul the **** over the coals for all I care, but christ....

[foxile5]

37 minutes ago, Super_horns said:

 

Will that satisfy both teachers and parents who might have have different concerns and priorities?

Weird that he's insisting that's the first restriction lifted when it's been repeatedly shown that schools are one of, if not the, leading cause in transmission.

 

Gyms, pubs, and shops all have a stronger case than opening the schools. 

[Thefox81]

32 minutes ago, Dahnsouff said:

There is no price, that was a typical self righteous response to a reasonable point. Investing now in such a review would hugely detract from vaccine rollout

 

When the air is clear, haul the **** over the coals for all I care, but christ....

I agree. Lets get this vaccine out to as many as possible then have an enquiry when (touch wood) we are in the clear.

 

Im no fan of Boris and think he has been woeful in everything barring the vaccine rollout but now is not the time.

 

Get us all safe then sort it out not now. Number 1 priority is to get the vaccine in the arms of as many people and as quickly as they can. No need for the political point scoring bullshit now. Work together.

[fuchsntf]

On 25.1.2021 at 22:06, Kopfkino said:

This story in Handelsblatt about Oxford-AZ is a worry either way. German politicians briefing that it’s only 8% effective in over-65s which follows reports that the EMA is only going to approve it for under-65s. Doesn’t include any data to prove it, nor anything on the record. But it might be worth noting the FDA isn’t rushing to approve it because of trial data errors.

 

If it is true, well then the UK’s vaccination success is not a success at all and would undermine future efforts massively. Plus a lot of the world is relying on it. If it’s not true, then wtf are the Germans doing briefing it. I know they’re pissed off cos AZ isn’t fulfilling its supply arrangement but that’s a seriously irresponsible way to respond.

The Germans I know aint pssed off, they are taking in their strid e Nobody is panicking about Vaccine musts,

they would rather be sure that the vaccine-program, entailes some forethought, and no panic push on a political-placebo....

Media and some who want to make political waves....are trying to Play the headlines...

The various countries folk, wont worry about other countries progammes, they'll be wanting & more thoughtfull to see their own country's Programme is

well planned & considered......> Its The only One that matters <..!!!

[foxile5]

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2021/jan/26/head-of-astrazeneca-confirms-uk-has-prior-claim-on-vaccine

 

Brussels demanding the EU gets served first and are told no. Quite pointed that EU centric Guardian are reporting that.