Spurs A Post Match Thread

[Nicolo Barella]

2 hours ago, hejammy said:

Like Jose has said in his interview. Today we got out thought. BR got tactically an ass whopping. Let's hope he sees this and perhaps comes back to the basics a bit and perhaps some humility. Give the players who deserve the chance to start. Don't have your "favourites" and be a bit more tactically astute. 

First and second goal were huge individual error, not sure how much you can blame tactics on that.

[ozleicester]

Spurs "Leicestered" us, but im pretty sure we won the possession stats

[volpeazzurro]

4 minutes ago, Nicolo Barella said:

First and second goal were huge individual error, not sure how much you can blame tactics on that.

It was forced error. Mourhinio isolated a poorly executed and cumbersome back three with patient counterattacking football, essentially he out 'Leicestered' us. 

[Nicolo Barella]

1 minute ago, volpeazzurro said:

It was forced error. Mourhinio isolated a poorly executed and cumbersome back three with patient counterattacking football, essentially he out 'Leicestered' us. 

That's fair enough, but I can't really see how else he would have lined us up with the personnel available, they could have easily exposed us anyway. This way at least allowed Justin and Thomas to be threats, they created quite a few chances for us.

[volpeazzurro]

3 minutes ago, Nicolo Barella said:

That's fair enough, but I can't really see how else he would have lined us up with the personnel available, they could have easily exposed us anyway. This way at least allowed Justin and Thomas to be threats, they created quite a few chances for us.

I think undoubtedly, to be without Ricardo, Chilwell and Soyuncu has to have been a big problem.

However, it's also problematic to play an unfamiliar back three system with unfamiliar players. Sheffield United didn't have a great or even mobile goal threat so it wasn't such an issue against them.

 

Last season we saw that Evans and Morgan were competent in a back four together even with lack of pace, I think strangley, even the stats showed less goals conceded than when Maguire was present but that isn’t always the full story in fairness.

 

Personally, with those experienced two and two rookies, rather than Bennett, I'd have felt an extra more mobile midfielder in the shape of Mendy or Praet would have been far more effective as protective and more mobile cover for the defence, possibly even Hamza. A back three of Evans, Morgan and Soyuncu if available may be a possibility because of Soyuncu's pace and comfort on the ball, but not the cumbersome Bennett, it was the waste of a player and poor tactically for me.

 

That's why I'm paid millions to sit in an armchair and make these tough decisions though ... oh I'm not am I and it's a lot easier from an armchair 😁

[volpeazzurro]

36 minutes ago, ozleicester said:

Spurs "Leicestered" us, but im pretty sure we won the possession stats

Absolutely we did, it was a fine example of our winning season when we'd regularly win with only 30% possession. If Rodgers models himself on Mourhinio as felt by some, he's got a bloody long way to go and I doubt he'll ever get anywhere near. He's a one trick pony.

[Nicolo Barella]

17 minutes ago, volpeazzurro said:

I think undoubtedly, to be without Ricardo, Chilwell and Soyuncu has to have been a big problem.

However, it's also problematic to play an unfamiliar back three system with unfamiliar players. Sheffield United didn't have a great or even mobile goal threat so it wasn't such an issue against them.

 

Last season we saw that Evans and Morgan were competent in a back four together even with lack of pace, I think strangley, even the stats showed less goals conceded than when Maguire was present but that isn’t always the full story in fairness.

 

Personally, with those experienced two and two rookies, rather than Bennett, I'd have felt an extra more mobile midfielder in the shape of Mendy or Praet would have been far more effective as protective and more mobile cover for the defence, possibly even Hamza. A back three of Evans, Morgan and Soyuncu if available may be a possibility because of Soyuncu's pace and comfort on the ball, but not the cumbersome Bennett, it was the waste of a player and poor tactically for me.

 

That's why I'm paid millions to sit in an armchair and make these tough decisions though ... oh I'm not am I and it's a lot easier from an armchair 😁

Fair enough. We will never know I suppose.

[Tom12345]

12 hours ago, st albans fox said:

So we don’t fall for the trap. 1-0 might be enough 

 

Seriously .....  lost count of the number of people last few days who saw exactly what happened  today ...... you didn’t have to be a football genius ..... the only way that approach works is if we get the first goal and can drop deep thereafter ......

Spurs are just difficult for us.  With Son and Kane upfront, we needed Soy to play instead of Bennett but unfortunately Soy was out, so not BR’s problem. I wouldn’t blame BR for the lost, as I do think we played good football at times (except for last 10 mins when we gave up trying to pull a goal back). But I do feel that we could do much better this season if BR reacted much earlier in Feb/Mar by changing formation and playing more round pegs through round holes.

 

The critical point was the early goal, which was unlucky for us. That suited Mourinho’s teams as he can then just sit back even more and wait for the counter, especially with our slower CBs.

[That_Dude]

11 hours ago, Lcfc82 said:

It started when the title winning side started to inevitably break up and the Chilwell / Maddison types replaced them

Lol, these two didn't even play and people still have a dig at them.

 

We sorely missed them yersterday.

[justfoxes]

One for the conspiracy theorists on FT 😉

 

https://www.liverpoolecho.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/what-joke-everton-fans-baffled-18624984

[st albans fox]

2 minutes ago, justfoxes said:

One for the conspiracy theorists on FT 😉

 

https://www.liverpoolecho.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/what-joke-everton-fans-baffled-18624984

As commented in the match thread, whilst there are some similarities, the differences are the reason it isn’t disallowed ...... 

[Danny Clender]

Mourinho gave us a tactical masterclass and outfoxed© Rodgers.

A breakdown of those tactics.

He used his forward players to attack our defence of Bennett, Evans, Morgan, Justin and Thomas and tricked them  into a false state of security (debatable).

Is that really a masterclass?

We did play some great football, they took their chances. 

 

© UK Media 2020.

[teblin]

Thing I don’t quite get the Rodgers is his adaptability.

 

with the back line we have available, I don’t think it would’ve been the worst idea to have mendy/hamza alongside wilf. 
 

but we do that at home to Brighton :/ 

 

Kane was always going to score because he always does! 
 

the lack of depth and injuries has caught up with us. We can’t seem to cope with key 1 player out, let alone 5

[StanSP]

5 hours ago, Nicolo Barella said:

Didn't watch the second half, how bad was it? I hate Bennet with a burning passion. Perez and Thomas were great offensively, shame 2 of the goals can be partially attributed to Thomas but I choose to blame Ryan "Sunday League" Bennet. I am unhappy to be vindicated about him, and about Spurs' pace giving them an easy win.

Camped in their half and resigned to shooting from distance. Gray had a free kick well saved, Iheanacho had a decent shot saved too. It was what Spurs were happy with to defend given the extent of their lead. 

 

A bit more creativity required to unpick a defence that sits back but given the circumstances and our depleted squad it was understandable. Had we scored either before they did or an early goal in the 2nd half, it could have been quite different. 

[teblin]

6 minutes ago, StanSP said:

Camped in their half and resigned to shooting from distance. Gray had a free kick well saved, Iheanacho had a decent shot saved too. It was what Spurs were happy with to defend given the extent of their lead. 

 

A bit more creativity required to unpick a defence that sits back but given the circumstances and our depleted squad it was understandable. Had we scored either before they did or an early goal in the 2nd half, it could have been quite different. 

Hirst might have done better with his header too.

[Ric Flair]

6 hours ago, Nicolo Barella said:

First and second goal were huge individual error, not sure how much you can blame tactics on that.

They were indeed and we created a number of chances ourselves but playing such a high defensive line with very little pace and falling in to Spurs trap was a gift for them. Mourinho said his plan was to give us the ball and sit back, we ought to have done the same for the the opening part of the game and see what happened. So many teams have played Spurs at their own game and often got results, but we made it all to easy for them in a hugely important game.

[Grebfromgrebland]

Thing is when you've got Morgan and Bennett at the back we have to defend like we have Morgan and Huth and stay deep and play counter attacking football.

 

Brendan got it wrong tactically and Jose got it right. Entice out defence high then hit the long ball just we used to do. 

 

Man Utd will look at this game and do the same to us when we play them and Rodgers will be too stubborn to counter act it.

 

Right now we're suffering for not strengthening in January when we knew we needed a right midfielder and first choice center back.

[Guest ttfn]

3 minutes ago, Ric Flair said:

They were indeed and we created a number of chances ourselves but playing such a high defensive line with very little pace and falling in to Spurs trap was a gift for them. Mourinho said his plan was to give us the ball and sit back, we ought to have done the same for the the opening part of the game and see what happened. So many teams have played Spurs at their own game and often got results, but we made it all to easy for them in a hugely important game.

But the xG shows that neither is Mourinho as smart as he thinks nor is Rodgers as naive as some are suggesting. Nor does it show we deserved to win, but it’s not a black-and-white tactical issue.

 

Its easy to post-rationalise and say that Mourinho got it right and Rodgers got it wrong when you see the score line but the manager can only be responsible for the pattern of play.

He’s not responsible for poor finishing or individual errors defensively - he can contribute to that by choosing tactics that put pressure on those players (as Rodgers did at Bournemouth) but the way the game was panning out was positive for us - our possession wasn’t sterile, we were getting in good positions and creating chances. You can pick holes in the tactics today all you like but there wasn’t a lot of choice - Vardy takes one of his difficult chances or Lloris has one of the many off days he seems to have against everybody apart from us and it’s a different game.

[foxinsocks]

We made 3 or 4 really hood chances. Great.

Spurs given too much space. Bennet is a donkey

[CosbehFox]

16 minutes ago, ttfn said:

But the xG shows that neither is Mourinho as smart as he thinks nor is Rodgers as naive as some are suggesting. Nor does it show we deserved to win, but it’s not a black-and-white tactical issue.

 

Its easy to post-rationalise and say that Mourinho got it right and Rodgers got it wrong when you see the score line but the manager can only be responsible for the pattern of play.

He’s not responsible for poor finishing or individual errors defensively - he can contribute to that by choosing tactics that put pressure on those players (as Rodgers did at Bournemouth) but the way the game was panning out was positive for us - our possession wasn’t sterile, we were getting in good positions and creating chances. You can pick holes in the tactics today all you like but there wasn’t a lot of choice - Vardy takes one of his difficult chances or Lloris has one of the many off days he seems to have against everybody apart from us and it’s a different game.

Excellent post. It wasn’t as black and white as it’s been billed. 

[Ricey]

26 minutes ago, ttfn said:

But the xG shows that neither is Mourinho as smart as he thinks nor is Rodgers as naive as some are suggesting. Nor does it show we deserved to win, but it’s not a black-and-white tactical issue.

 

Its easy to post-rationalise and say that Mourinho got it right and Rodgers got it wrong when you see the score line but the manager can only be responsible for the pattern of play.

He’s not responsible for poor finishing or individual errors defensively - he can contribute to that by choosing tactics that put pressure on those players (as Rodgers did at Bournemouth) but the way the game was panning out was positive for us - our possession wasn’t sterile, we were getting in good positions and creating chances. You can pick holes in the tactics today all you like but there wasn’t a lot of choice - Vardy takes one of his difficult chances or Lloris has one of the many off days he seems to have against everybody apart from us and it’s a different game.

There wasn’t much choice in personnel but there very much was a choice to commit that many bodies forward (even at 0-0!) and push the back line as high as it was.

 

That one glaring tactical error cost us the match by half time and rendered some of our other decent play useless.

 

Spurs we always going to entice us into it. It was so obvious. They were always going to let our defenders have the ball and draw them up the pitch. This is something a lot of teams do to us even with our first-choice back line.

 

I just cannot believe a manager of Rodgers experience has fallen for it. We needed to be the ones deploying the low block today and protecting that back line. Tottenham would have done the same, which would have created spaces in the middle, which would have suited Tielemans in particular.
 

However Rodgers finds it unbearable to move away from his idealist philosophy to get a result. That’s something Celtic fans warned us about, especially in Europe when they were playing better teams. Rodgers wouldn’t accept that fact and adapt accordingly.

[Matt]

7 hours ago, ozleicester said:

Spurs "Leicestered" us, but im pretty sure we won the possession stats

And that’s what matters in this modern age of football.

Edited 20 July 2020 by Matt

[Mapperleyfox]

Injuries notwithstanding, we're too soft, easy to play against and a mess at the back.

 

Watching us right now reminds me of how vulnerable we were under Micky Adams, always likely to make a mistake.

 

Too many not up to the level we need. Justin, Morgan, Bennett, Barnes, Gray, Perez, Thomas all way off the quality required for different reasons so we're carrying too many sub standard players.

 

Align that with a fragile attitude and we're so easy to beat. The team of 2016 would LOVE to play against this lot.

Edited 20 July 2020 by Mapperleyfox

[Grebfromgrebland]

We were Leicestered and got our tactics wrong. 

 

We're beginning to sound like Spurs, "but we had more shots and possession..."

 

Remember how we reacted to that kind of talk?

[That_Dude]

20 hours ago, Beechey said:

Reckon vs United I’d just have the deepest, filthiest block and try and nab a goal on the counter

Then Rodgers gets toasted for not having a go at them. I know I will.