West Ham (A) Mon 23/08/21 @ 8pm

[Silebyfox_89]

Thought i'd make a point of watching Newcastle vs WHU on MOTD2 to get a feel of how west ham played couple of things i noticed:

 

• Saint-Maxillian did very well with holding the ball and taking a couple of players like Rice out of play
• Both goals they conceded were from crosses 1 from wide and played deep (Ritchie) & a floating ball by S-Max to Wilson, both times the WHU CB's were both ball watching.

Couple of conclusions from this may be that Soumare should play for Physicality & ball retention n release, Also maybe play Albrighton instead of Perez to offer crossing ability & defensive cover too.

 

Could be wrong but that's my thoughts anyway.

[Dandy king]

Albrighton in for Perez and nacho in for Maddison I reckon please Brendon many thanks 

[urban fox]

45 minutes ago, Dandy king said:

Albrighton in for Perez and nacho in for Maddison I reckon please Brendon many thanks 

I agree. This is what i would go with. Whist Perez is decent at tracking back, Marc gives us that extra bit of steel down the right when pressed or against the counter and can be relied on to get good crosses in. Nacho is in in place of Maddison who may still be suffering the effects of getting clattered in the back. Now we have better options in the squad, there is no need to risk starting anyone who is not 100%, as any forced early changes due to injury, as happened with Madders on Saturday, dictates a change in the game plan and our ability to swap things around/fresh legs later in the game (eg Daka for Vardy, soumare/KDH/Praet to go 433 or diamond etc) Also Albrightons delivery from set pieces could be a factor against their CBs who looked shaky for the two newcastle goals, especially with either big Dan or Vestergaard in the mix.

Hopefully we will resist the temptation to go 3 at back from the off as in this instance i think we would be exposed. If we are defending a slender lead with 10 mins to go then fair enough but for me this is a game that needs a back four and solid midfield to contain the likes of Antonio and stop Rice and Soucek from dictating the game. If we can get on top and boss midfield then i think we will have enough firepower to win this.

2-1 to us Vardy and Nacho, Antonio for them

[filbertway]

Interesting that people want us to basically sit on the edge of our own box all game but don't want any pace or creativity in the team. You'd think we had just got promoted

 

[jmono84]

On 17/08/2021 at 14:36, foxfan92 said:

Stop being such a pessimist.

 

We've never been caught out by playing a high line against the Hammers before ...

Yea only 6 times which I think over a course of 180mins aint too bad 😜

[Mickey O'Neil]

I was dreading this game tbh. However, I've just watched Vardy's Greatest Shithousery Moments Vol.1 and I feel slightly better

 

Still not massively confident but what the hell. 

 

I'd love to see Soumaré get a full game

[Dr The Singh]

This game is about how we control Antonio.  BR and the team will have plans I'm sure.   

 

I see this match as one we can win if we can be defensive enough and take our chances.

[Kierzz]

On 17/08/2021 at 12:23, volpeazzurro said:

It would make sense wouldn't it. Soyuncu has got a bit of pace but Vestergaard, for all his good points, is slow with the turning circle of a land rover. Armarty is better than some give him credit for but prone to the odd gaff. Why not therefore sacrifice one of them, I'd suggest Armarty, for a better midfield footballer who could stop us getting overrun in the first place? Two proper full backs and not makeshift wing backs would also help matters. No place for Perez in this, if Rodgers insists on a wide right player then Albrighton offers so much more in a game like this to help cover Ricardo. 

 

With regard to Perez, I agree he should be dropped.

 

However, Rodgers likes playing him as he tucks in from the right as a second number 10 who can receive the ball between the lines alongside Maddison. This also allows Ricardo more space to attack the right wing.

 

Albrighton can't play as a second number 10 so it would mean we would need to go with a slightly different formation in attacking scenarios. I think Praet is the only player who can do a similar job to Perez in this system.

[volpeazzurro]

2 hours ago, Kierzz said:

 

With regard to Perez, I agree he should be dropped.

 

However, Rodgers likes playing him as he tucks in from the right as a second number 10 who can receive the ball between the lines alongside Maddison. This also allows Ricardo more space to attack the right wing.

 

Albrighton can't play as a second number 10 so it would mean we would need to go with a slightly different formation in attacking scenarios. I think Praet is the only player who can do a similar job to Perez in this system.

There's always an updated theory about Rodgers usage of Perez but as yet, I've struggled to see one that he's really competent in. If someone is given the sort of game time that he's had, they're bound to have the odd good touch in a game, the rest of the time his contribution remains questionable. Yet it's those odd good touches that some seem to cling onto like the Emperor's new clothes.

 

I wonder what contributions Praet would have made given the same amount of opportunities. I agree re Albrighton, but has Perez really been that effective as a number 10? His goal and assist stats from last season hardly suggest opposition defenders would be quaking in their boots at the sight of him. If the same defenders had a front three of any of Barnes, Vardy, Iheanacho or Daka buzzing round I think they'd be a little more worried.

 

Let's be honest, our highest goalscorer last season was seemingly only put into the side by Rodgers because he had little choice through injury. I do wonder sometimes whether the fact he kept scoring erked him on occasions because Iheanacho really rammed the lack of faith the manager had in him down his throat somewhat and whilst he kept scoring and getting regular praise from pundits, it was almost impossible for Rodgers to drop him. 

 

If Rodgers reverts to 3 at the back and Perez against West Ham then I fear the worst. I appreciate Armarty's contribution but to have both him and Perez in the side against a decent team when there's viable alternatives would be crass really. Hopefully lessons have been learned from last year.

[volpeazzurro]

12 hours ago, filbertway said:

Interesting that people want us to basically sit on the edge of our own box all game but don't want any pace or creativity in the team. You'd think we had just got promoted

 

We've more than enough cover and talent in the squad now to let teams start worrying about us. As you say, no need to sit back. 

[cruzFOX]

The Hammers pretty much whooped us twice last time. They will be full of confidence and have zero fear because we gave them nothing to fear last time. It's time BR and the team use this moment to surprise the opposition. It's pretty transparent how the Hammers will play so it's comes down to what are we going to do about it? I know its early in the season but this will be a real good contest and we'll have to be razor sharp on the day that means no lazy passes or fannying about with the ball at the back only for it to get intercepted. Time to be fast, direct and effective. Get some goals in early to give them something to think about.

[volpeazzurro]

4 hours ago, cruzFOX said:

The Hammers pretty much whooped us twice last time. They will be full of confidence and have zero fear because we gave them nothing to fear last time. It's time BR and the team use this moment to surprise the opposition. It's pretty transparent how the Hammers will play so it's comes down to what are we going to do about it? I know its early in the season but this will be a real good contest and we'll have to be razor sharp on the day that means no lazy passes or fannying about with the ball at the back only for it to get intercepted. Time to be fast, direct and effective. Get some goals in early to give them something to think about.

Agreed. In those two games due to formation and personnel, we offered no threat to their defence and were overrun in midfield. We now have a squad of players to choose from to rectify that imo.

[ARM1968]

Just got to avoid defeat. These made mugs of us and BR last season home and away. We are a better side technically but they are more physical. A draw would be a good result. 

[Angus Scott]

Why is everyone so worried about us playing these? Is it because they scored 4 against a very poor Newcastle team.

We are better than them & whilst I agree it will be a tough game, one we can win. 

If we are panicking like this for West Ham, I dread to think what it will be like when we play one of the 4 champions league teams.

[goose2010]

1 minute ago, Angus Scott said:

Why is everyone so worried about us playing these? Is it because they scored 4 against a very poor Newcastle team.

We are better than them & whilst I agree it will be a tough game, one we can win. 

If we are panicking like this for West Ham, I dread to think what it will be like when we play one of the 4 champions league teams.

Think it's more the fact they probably have us two of the toughest games last season. 

 

We struggle more against a strong physical side than a top 4 team. 

[coolhandfox]

1 hour ago, volpeazzurro said:

Agreed. In those two games due to formation and personnel, we offered no threat to their defence and were overrun in midfield. We now have a squad of players to choose from to rectify that imo.

First game yes, second game we scored twice and Fofana should have scored late onto to make it 3-3, we had 15 shots to their 4.

Edited 19 August 2021 by coolhandfox

[daddylonglegs]

I've seen so many comments slagging off a 5 at the back - i think i was watching a completely different game to a lot of people on Saturday

 

We were getting absolutely slaughtered for the first 15 mins of the second half with 4 at the back, then moved to 5 and had control of the game besides a few individual errors? 

 

Not saying we should play it every game but I don't think its a bad option

[Finnegan]

43 minutes ago, Angus Scott said:

Why is everyone so worried about us playing these?

 

Because they absolutely shagged us twice last year? 

 

In fairness, Rodgers showed good learning last year against teams who dicked us the year before. In 19/20 we were awful against Man City and Liverpool, we tried to go toe to toe, played in to their hands and got humbled. Last year he learned, adapted and played a game designed to counter them. 

 

Last season we played straight in to West Hams hands in both games, playing a ridiculously slow, patient game with an absurdly high defensive line and lacking width going forward. They smothered us and killed us on the break. 

 

So if Rodgers learns from that we could be fine. If he doesn't, uh oh.

 

First goal will be everything I suspect. 

[sacreblueits442]

34 minutes ago, Angus Scott said:

Why is everyone so worried about us playing these? Is it because they scored 4 against a very poor Newcastle team.

We are better than them & whilst I agree it will be a tough game, one we can win. 

If we are panicking like this for West Ham, I dread to think what it will be like when we play one of the 4 champions league teams.

....strangely enough, it would not be in anyway be seen as games to fear, coming up against the 4 Champions League teams!!!

West Ham have last season made us look very much second best and irrespective of other teams we have played, they seemed to have got the measure of us. Any chance to inflict a bloody nose on the big boys is always welcomed, something to get excited about, but they (West Ham) appear to hold the sword of Damocles over our heads each time we met last season.

  I think we have met them too soon this season, with Soumare not yet up to speed and therefore KDH could have a big part to play in this game as the game will be won in the middle of the park.

[ARM1968]

1 hour ago, Angus Scott said:

Why is everyone so worried about us playing these? Is it because they scored 4 against a very poor Newcastle team.

We are better than them & whilst I agree it will be a tough game, one we can win. 

If we are panicking like this for West Ham, I dread to think what it will be like when we play one of the 4 champions league teams.

No, it’s because they battered us last season. 

[mozartfox]

#nopillockingaroundwith5atthebackpleaseBR

 

Timmy at RB and Ricardo moved forward in place of Perez. Daka on as a sub at some stage.

[jmono84]

We will try and control the game again but we can’t be as poor defensively like the last two games. I still

shudder when thinking about how easy it was for them to score those 6 goals against us!

 

We can’t be that bad defending again surely! I did say this last time tho 😂😂

[coolhandfox]

No surprise we struggle against a team that physically, willing to sit in a low block and counter. 

 

We are now seen as one of the top side in the division and team sit up to frustrate us and counter.

 

1st goal is massive on Monday.

 

We need to keep it tight, if we do their fans turn quickly, will be interesting to see how W Ham cope with the return of fans. 

 

[volpeazzurro]

17 hours ago, daddylonglegs said:

I've seen so many comments slagging off a 5 at the back - i think i was watching a completely different game to a lot of people on Saturday

 

We were getting absolutely slaughtered for the first 15 mins of the second half with 4 at the back, then moved to 5 and had control of the game besides a few individual errors? 

 

Not saying we should play it every game but I don't think its a bad option

Even with 5, I never for one minute felt we were in control but in fairness it was an improvement. I don't however blame it on the 4 at the back, more that with the inclusion of Armarty and Perez you essentially weaken your team. I think Soumare's introduction into midfield with Perez and Maddison going off helped also. 

Edited 20 August 2021 by volpeazzurro

[Angus Scott]

27 minutes ago, ARM1968 said:

No, it’s because they battered us last season. 

I agree we were second best against them, but remember the away game followed the infamous party night resulting in us missing some players. I'm certain this affected our performance that day