Puel 'Facing the sack' - reports

[NewquayFox]

Rumours rumours rumours, might be gone.... 

[Babylon]

26 minutes ago, smudgerfox said:

What a lot of the seventh place evangelists are missing is that a lot of our players have been persuaded to come or stay because they've been told this is a club moving significantly forward, not one content to finish mid-table, maybe scrape a Europa League place and report for pre-season training in June. In the summer there's likely to be Top Six interest in Chilwell, Maguire, Maddison, possibly Pereira. If there is, they'll each have to weigh up guaranteed first team football, Europa League Thursdays (plus starting in July) - and that's if we do qualify, against playing in the Champions League for one of the big clubs and raising their wages. Very quickly you can turn  into Southampton - each season, at best, turning up a new raft of proven Premier League talent for the big clubs to exploit. And eventually that talent runs dry or the manager cocks up or both, and you get relegated. And you look back at the talent you could have used to build a team and wonder why no-one had the ambition to keep your best and go for it.

What's your point? We need to be winning cups every season to keep our players? Not, going, to, happen.

 

All this "we'll lose our players" stuff is totally redundant. Unless we get taken over by Bill Gates and Steve Job's ghost, spending billions and billions to the point of being bigger than Man City, Barca and Madrid combined, it's still going to happen.

[Babylon]

1 minute ago, NewquayFox said:

Rumours rumours rumours, might be gone.... 

Care to add some substance to that?

[Bunyip]

44 minutes ago, Milo said:

I disagree - I had totally made peace with playing in the Championship when Claudio was taking us down. It was far preferable to watching the weird anti-football that we were playing, imo.

 

One thing the Championship is not is boring.  

Ask all those big clubs fans in the championship who have been languishing there for years if it's exciting then.

[NotTheMarketLeader]

39 minutes ago, smudgerfox said:

What a lot of the seventh place evangelists are missing is that a lot of our players have been persuaded to come or stay because they've been told this is a club moving significantly forward, not one content to finish mid-table, maybe scrape a Europa League place and report for pre-season training in June. In the summer there's likely to be Top Six interest in Chilwell, Maguire, Maddison, possibly Pereira. If there is, they'll each have to weigh up guaranteed first team football, Europa League Thursdays (plus starting in July) - and that's if we do qualify, against playing in the Champions League for one of the big clubs and raising their wages. Very quickly you can turn  into Southampton - each season, at best, turning up a new raft of proven Premier League talent for the big clubs to exploit. And eventually that talent runs dry or the manager cocks up or both, and you get relegated. And you look back at the talent you could have used to build a team and wonder why no-one had the ambition to keep your best and go for it.

There is a point within this which I raised a few weeks ago.

 

We should have been going eyeballs out for the Cup competitions in the last two years because this crop of players will not be here much longer. They will be going elsewhere probably this summer.

 

This system of ‘keeping the powder dry’ is part of this myth of Claude building a team for the future. It can’t happen at a club of our stature in this day and age. We need to strike while the iron is hot or the moment is gone and so are the players.

Edited 8 January 2019 by NotTheMarketLeader

[Milo]

Just now, Bunyip said:

Ask all those big clubs fans in the championship who have been languishing there for years if it's exciting then.

In your opinion it's boring - in my opinion it's not.

 

 

[Ric Flair]

59 minutes ago, Babylon said:

I just looked at the team, doesn't look bad in terms of age other than a few defenders 30+. From what I can see it looks like the amount he's spent has done for him. They spent £30m on Afobe, Ince and Clucas... and another £20m on Mcclean, Etebo and Woods. Ouch.

Yeah his team isn't as old at Stoke but he's definitely gone down the route of spending big on supposed proven players and it's grim viewing. His Derby team was very old, straight out the Micky Adams text book.

[AlloverthefloorYesNdidi]

3 minutes ago, Milo said:

In your opinion it's boring - in my opinion it's not.

 

 

Championship matches are not boring, I would agree, but I would never accept relegation

[ealingfox]

1 hour ago, Babylon said:

I just looked at the team, doesn't look bad in terms of age other than a few defenders 30+. From what I can see it looks like the amount he's spent has done for him. They spent £30m on Afobe, Ince and Clucas... and another £20m on Mcclean, Etebo and Woods. Ouch.

 

Not each surely? I dunno, Is 50m on 6 would-be first team players that bad these days even in the Champo? Particularly when you've got the parachute payments.

 

At a glance as I've obvs not watched any Stoke this season I've got to assume poor management and not getting the best out of them as they're not really poor signings bar McClean.

 

Afobe - scores goals at that level

Ince - bang average but reasonably effective at that level 

Clucas - seemed to be playing well last couple of years

McClean - garbage

Etebo - was highly-rated wasn't he? Sure we were linked with him at one time.

Woods - good player and had Champo experience.

[Wdywd]

Etebo was odd as they signed him just before the World Cup as like a pre-emptive overreaction to him looking decent there

[Babylon]

3 minutes ago, ealingfox said:

Not each surely? I dunno, Is 50m on 6 would-be first team players that bad these days even in the Champo?

Yes.

[coolhandfox]

38 minutes ago, Dames said:

Change of tactics against the teams that come to defend against us. We'd be converting a lot more draws into wins and losses into draws/wins if the shackles were off.

 

The patient style of play doesn't suit those type of games and its clear to see. When we are defending against these teams there is hardly any pressure on the ball, its stand off, be patient, don't dive in. Granted this has resulted in a better defensive record and the bookings and sending offs seem to have also dried up but I feel its taken a slight edge away from the team. This team is capable of pressuring and maintaining that pressure, forcing mistakes, breaking quickly on the counter but at the minute it is being handicapped by the patient safety first style of play. When we are attacking its the same, its all patient build up and side ways passing. We don't have a player that is capable of consistently 'unlocking' stubborn defenses and it shows, how many times to we get to the edge of an 18 yard box against 2 banks of 4 and all of a sudden we are playing it all the way back to the keeper, giving the opposing team a chance to reset. On top of that as we are not pressuring these teams often enough it allows them to conserve energry and pressure/break against us.

 

I think we are one or two creative players away from making this work but in the meantime I think Puel has to be more adventurous than he has been, we have a lot of pace and energy up front, let them put the pressure on a bit more and force the issue, I think by doing this we'll start scoring more.

For me this will change as we improve the personal at Puel's disposal, we have struggled to break down teams who sit back for a good three season under CR, CS and now Puel. Maddison is a step in the right direction, but we need more players with the ability to beat a man or pick a pass, it may take us a couple more windows to acquire players with this skill set.  

 

I don't think we have the players to play a pressing game, Vardy isn't a spring chicken any more and need to conserve energy for when we have the ball, Maddison has struggle to complete 90 mins for most of the season. Ghezzal and Nacho pressing really? Thats leave Gray and Albrighton who probable could.

 

I think we are still capable of scoring on the Counter, we have scored a number of goals in that manner this season, once again now Vardy is nearing full fitness, we will score more. 

[Wymsey]

Sacking him would unsettle a squad that is in itself unsettled in their match results.

[StevieB]

51 minutes ago, NewquayFox said:

Rumours rumours rumours, might be gone.... 

Seen that on twitter too ?

[ealingfox]

11 minutes ago, Babylon said:

Yes.

 

Obviously it's not right, as spending anything when you're below 17th in the PL is tinpot and should be nothing but peppercorn and chicken feed.

 

But sure they're not the first to spend that much - teams without the PL money have probably done more in the last few years.

[BKLFox]

2 hours ago, lcfceaves said:

Like I said, one or two... I was just trying to put points down from both sides of the argument even though I am 70/30 wanting him out. Vardy was my main concern, yes he tried to put a spin on it, but saying it doesn't suit him... secretly I am sure he knew what he was doing there.

Name a team that would soley play to Vardy's strength & have him as a starter

[TMELcfc]

1 minute ago, BKLFox said:

Name a team that would soley play to Vardy's strength & have him as a starter

Us... think we won the league doing it... 

Im not saying go back to those days, I know we needed a new approach but far too often our play is now way to safe... hardly any forward passes and not only that, the tempo is too slow. Our home form has been hit by teams feeling their way in too easily.  

[AKCJ]

29 minutes ago, Wdywd said:

Etebo was odd as they signed him just before the World Cup as like a pre-emptive overreaction to him looking decent there

Yeah what sort of idiotic club would do that...

 

 

[Dames]

20 minutes ago, coolhandfox said:

For me this will change as we improve the personal at Puel's disposal, we have struggled to break down teams who sit back for a good three season under CR, CS and now Puel. Maddison is a step in the right direction, but we need more players with the ability to beat a man or pick a pass, it may take us a couple more windows to acquire players with this skill set.  

 

I don't think we have the players to play a pressing game, Vardy isn't a spring chicken any more and need to conserve energy for when we have the ball, Maddison has struggle to complete 90 mins for most of the season. Ghezzal and Nacho pressing really? Thats leave Gray and Albrighton who probable could.

 

I think we are still capable of scoring on the Counter, we have scored a number of goals in that manner this season, once again now Vardy is nearing full fitness, we will score more. 

You're definitely right about the struggling - this has happened since before Puel came in and I think there is a mentality around the team that not losing is the main priority. This started happening towards the end of the title winning season but that was a freak season as it all played into our hands, teams came to attack us as they still thought we were 'little old Leicester'. Since then we've been figured out massively and I hate saying this but for most teams outside the top 6 we are probably regarded as one of the easier games of the season.

 

I think we do have the players, we have young energetic full backs who can run, press and attack all day long. Ndidi needs those shackles taking off and he can also run and press all day long. Vardy can manage it once a week and like you said Albrighton and Gray can also play the pressing game. That leaves you with Maddison to sit in between the lines and pick up the ball in transition and release it quickly, Mendy screening the defence (personally I'd have Hamza in with Ndidi interchanging between pressing and screening as that kind of energy rubs off but Puel prefers Mendy and Ndidi as his first choice). We've got a young an fit enough team to play that style - it also opens up the counter attacking option a lot more than currently.

 

Surely there is a better option of passing sideways/backwards and occassionally lumping it into the box to nobody from either a cross or a punt forwards? At the minute we are relying far too much on nicking a goal instead of forcing the issue.

[UPinCarolina]

1 hour ago, Milo said:

In your opinion it's boring - in my opinion it's not.

 

 

In anyone's opinion, languishing in the Championship is not good for the club.

[Milo]

15 minutes ago, UPinCarolina said:

In anyone's opinion, languishing in the Championship is not good for the club.

100% Agree - you might have missed the earlier post above, though.

 

I don't want to get relegated and/or languish anywhere. Was merely responding to a point made that stated the Championship is boring. I don't think it is.  

 

 

 

[BKLFox]

35 minutes ago, lcfceaves said:

Us... think we won the league doing it... 

Im not saying go back to those days, I know we needed a new approach but far too often our play is now way to safe... hardly any forward passes and not only that, the tempo is too slow. Our home form has been hit by teams feeling their way in too easily.  

I agree with the build-up it needs to be slicker but against the lower teams who sit deep the backwards/sideways passing is deployed to try & shift them from their shape, this looks horrible when they don't commit & yes when they do commit we need to be faster to exploit it but when its worked there’s a lot on here that suggest its the players doing their own thing, but far from it, they have just actioned the plan quicker.
Puel still needs time/windows to get those missing links between defence & attack as pointed out there are so many that need to be shipped out prior to getting in new players that fit his style.
Sticking with Vardy it is down to him to adapt, the fact you mentioned us from 2yrs ago as a team that would play to his style suggests there isn't a team out there now that would, not a team above us for sure.
His England goal scoring record is much like his City 1, he's scored 4 of his 7 goals against the top teams Germany, Spain, Holland, Italy the teams that would have come at England, I'm sure if Vardy wasn't so 1 dimensional at the time he would have had a lot more caps & goals.
I don't think there was an underlying dig with his comment, i think he knows he has to change tactically to fit the change of formation & an aging body.

[fuchsntf]

1 hour ago, Babylon said:

What's your point? We need to be winning cups every season to keep our players? Not, going, to, happen.

 

All this "we'll lose our players" stuff is totally redundant. Unless we get taken over by Bill Gates and Steve Job's ghost, spending billions and billions to the point of being bigger than Man City, Barca and Madrid combined, it's still going to happen.

But..but...but. isn't that what they call obvious...Whoops forgot!!  This is Foxes forum!!..

Edited 8 January 2019 by fuchsntf

[smudgerfox]

1 hour ago, Babylon said:

What's your point? We need to be winning cups every season to keep our players? Not, going, to, happen.

 

All this "we'll lose our players" stuff is totally redundant. Unless we get taken over by Bill Gates and Steve Job's ghost, spending billions and billions to the point of being bigger than Man City, Barca and Madrid combined, it's still going to happen.

 

Oh dear.....subtitles required. So a lot of people saying we're seventh, and we should be happy to be seventh. Never mind the Cups, it's the league which brings in the money. Seventh as high as LCFC can expect to be - stop moaning. I hope that's a fair summary.

 

What I'm saying is that once you settle for that, once the players know you've settled for that, then what reason do they have to stay? Are they going to tell their grandchildren of the glorious three seasons on the trot they finished seventh in the EPL? Of the time they scored a hat trick in the frozen wastes of Russia in the third qualifying round (away leg) of the Europa League? And once the players don't want to stay, what are you left with? Watching a team in permanent transition, trying to replace gifted players year on year. And then the one year you fail, you get relegated. Stoke have gone, Southampton will go.

 

 

 

 

 

Edited 8 January 2019 by smudgerfox

[AlloverthefloorYesNdidi]

1 minute ago, smudgerfox said:

 

Oh dear.....subtitles required. So a lot of people saying we're seventh, and we should be happy to be seventh. Never mind the Cups, it's the league which brings in the money. Seventh as high as LCFC can expect to be - stop moaning. I hope that's a fair summary.

 

What I'm saying is that once you settle for that, once the players know you've settled for that, then what reason do they have to stay? Are they going to tell their grandchildren of the glorious three seasons on the trot they finished seventh in the EPL? Of the time they scored a hat trick in the frozen wastes of Russia in the third qualifying round (away leg) of the Europa League? And once the players don't want to stay, what are you left with? Watching a team in permanent transition, trying to replace gifted players year on year. And then the one year you fail, you get relegated. Stoke have gone, Southampton will go.

 

 

 

 

 

Puel has been here for little more than a year!  Nobody is saying be happy with 7th forever, only that for where we are now its pretty good so its crazy to talk of sacking the manager.

 

And 7th would be an admirable achievement for this club this season