Harvey Barnes

[murphy]

4 hours ago, Gubbins said:

😄 Christ where to begin with this. Again the idea that by middling PL player I mean crap. The whole league is made up of middling players for God's sake. Competent but not outstanding. That's not a bad thing. Bit arrogant to assume otherwise... Much like your dismissal of Jeff flippin Schlupp who after Heskey has been one of the very few players to have a prem career that we've produced. 

I don't see how me thinking that Barnes won't make it as a truly top level player which I'm happy to be wrong about by the way makes me think we're a juggernaut??? Dearie me are you a relative of his?

You could begin by trying to actually understand what I said.  I never said that your assessment that he will not amount to more than a middling PL player means he is crap, but it is you that is saying that level of player is not good enough for us as if we are some kind of PL superpower, hence the juggernaut reference.  The very best will not come to us.

 

I really don't think that you are a good judge of potential and I definitely don't think that you can assess an academy player's ceiling after his first year at this level.  He is already at least a 'middling PL' player imo and there is surely more to come given his age.  I think he will become a special player and I will be happy for you to be proven wrong too.  Do you not understand that youth needs to develop?  He won't reach his peak for another 2 or 3 years at least.

 

As for Schlupp, Barnes is already streets ahead of him.  In fact we have three academy graduates that are already better than he is.

 

You are living up nicely to your username.

 

 

Edited 2 February 2020 by murphy

[The Horse's Mouth]

Think the problem with Barnes is we probably rely on him too early,mans clearly very talented but has been thrown into the deep end. Do wonder if we werent 3rd the vitriol would be abit lesser 

[FOXSE]

1 minute ago, The Horse's Mouth said:

Think the problem with Barnes is we probably rely on him too early,mans clearly very talented but has been thrown into the deep end. Do wonder if we werent 3rd the vitriol would be abit lesser 

Barnes' goals and assists stats are now better than Daniel James at man u... And he is supposed to be unbelievable!

[The Horse's Mouth]

1 minute ago, FOXSE said:

Barnes' goals and assists stats are now better than Daniel James at man u... And he is supposed to be unbelievable!

So what?

[FOXSE]

1 minute ago, The Horse's Mouth said:

So what?

If Barnes was playing for man u, with his current stats, he would be in the England squad.

 

He is doing well, and will get better....

[Ric Flair]

43 minutes ago, sdb said:

You're confusing average with overrated. If he played for a side that wasn't full of mediocre, defensive players and god awful attackers his stats would be far better.

That's not necessarily true, as I've said with Perez. Scores 13 last season in a hugely defensive Newcastle team, this season in an extremely attacking team he is unlikely to get more than that. Zaha suits Palace as the whole team is built around him and him only from an attacking sense.

[Nicolo Barella]

2 hours ago, Finnegan said:

Zaha has like six years of development on Barnes, of course Barnes has some learning to do. 

 

I'd much rather have Barnes in my team though, he works hard for the team, his first thought isn't just his own glory, he takes people on directly at pace and heads towards dangerous areas instead of just attempting to dribble round people for ego. 

 

It's his first proper Premier League season and he's got four goals and six assists in 23 games. 

 

That's really not bad. 

Only 17 starts as well

[Shane]

In terms of ability I don’t think there’s much between Barnes and Hudson-Odoi. 

[thegaffa]

I’m a fan of Barnes, We all know he should of scored more than he has given the chances he has had, he will improve in this area no doubt.

 

just a question to the guys doubting his ability/level or worth to the team, would you prefer Barnes to keep getting into the positions to score more or effectively stay out wide and not try and contribute with goals?

 

Barnes has realistically played one season in the premier and has scored 5 goals in 42 premier appearances.

 

The legend that is Jamie Vardy only scored 5 goals in 34 appearances in his first premier season.

 

I know they play in different positions but give the lad time to develop that side of his game.

[GeorgeTheFox]

I can't believe the negativity there is around him from some of our fans. People talk about players like Mahrez having no loyalty but when we have two academy players in chilwell and Barnes playing regularly in a top 4 Leicester side and they get regularly slated by our own 'fans' you can't blame players for not being loyal. Get a ****ing grip we've have years of utter dross from the academy so get behind local lads like Choudhury cos otherwise we'll lose them 

[Jonaldinho]

2 hours ago, Ric Flair said:

That's not necessarily true, as I've said with Perez. Scores 13 last season in a hugely defensive Newcastle team, this season in an extremely attacking team he is unlikely to get more than that. Zaha suits Palace as the whole team is built around him and him only from an attacking sense.

But it does mean Zaha usually has two or three players on him as Palace don't offer much of a threat otherwise. 

[Guest An Sionnach]

1 hour ago, thegaffa said:

would you prefer Barnes to keep getting into the positions to score more or effectively stay out wide and not try and contribute with goals?

I keep highlighting that Barnes is not by nature a wide player . He will always be more effective inside and the same goes more obviously for Perez . Our only true wide player among the squad is Albrighton. 

[Father Ted]

Why are people slagging Barnes off? Arguably been our best player since the turn of the year and had it not been for a costly miss yesterday, we would all be raving about his performance. It seems as though he has a new found confidence and fearlessness that we were all desperately hoping that he would find. There were occasions where 2 or 3 months ago he would have just turned back and passed it to Chilwell but yesterday his first thought every time was to get the ball and drive at the full back. 

 

He will become a pivotal player for us, mark my words.

[Meat and 2 veg]

25 minutes ago, An Sionnach said:

I keep highlighting that Barnes is not by nature a wide player . He will always be more effective inside and the same goes more obviously for Perez . Our only true wide player among the squad is Albrighton. 

Says everything because Albrighton is not good enough

[Guest An Sionnach]

1 minute ago, Meat and 2 veg said:

Says everything because Albrighton is not good enough

Our way of playing has changed so much . When we won the premiership we used Marc and Mahrez as wide players . That worked very well then obviously but our main strength now is down the middle and Albrighton just doesn't fit in .

[Suffolk exile]

1 hour ago, Father Ted said:

Why are people slagging Barnes off? Arguably been our best player since the turn of the year and had it not been for a costly miss yesterday, we would all be raving about his performance. It seems as though he has a new found confidence and fearlessness that we were all desperately hoping that he would find. There were occasions where 2 or 3 months ago he would have just turned back and passed it to Chilwell but yesterday his first thought every time was to get the ball and drive at the full back. 

 

He will become a pivotal player for us, mark my words.

Absolutely this. Let's get behind him, why would we not??

[Gubbins]

2 hours ago, murphy said:

You could begin by trying to actually understand what I said.  I never said that your assessment that he will not amount to more than a middling PL player means he is crap, but it is you that is saying that level of player is not good enough for us as if we are some kind of PL superpower, hence the juggernaut reference.  The very best will not come to us.

 

I really don't think that you are a good judge of potential and I definitely don't think that you can assess an academy player's ceiling after his first year at this level.  He is already at least a 'middling PL' player imo and there is surely more to come given his age.  I think he will become a special player and I will be happy for you to be proven wrong too.  Do you not understand that youth needs to develop?  He won't reach his peak for another 2 or 3 years at least.

 

As for Schlupp, Barnes is already streets ahead of him.  In fact we have three academy graduates that are already better than he is.

 

You are living up nicely to your username.

 

 

Kudos on your closing line by the way 😄. A much less angry reply than your previous one so I'll do the same. 

 

I honestly don't think we are some PL juggernaut but If we succeed in being a top 4 challenger over the next few years it's my opinion that hel end up more of a squad player. I don't get the impression hel develop quickly enough to that sort of level and that he is def someone we could find an upgrade on. Hes not terrible (other than at converting chances) but I don't personally see the special something that I see in say Maddison and Ndidi who are not much older and wel prob become regulars in Europe one way or another.

If though we end up dropping back to something more akin to the last few seasons hel comparatively look a lot better and be a regular starter. 

 

Perhaps Im not a good judge of potential (I was convinced Harry Kane would be a one season wonder!) But at the same time I don't throw in with the perceived wisdom that young players are just guaranteed to come on in leaps and bounds until they hit a certain age. The likes of Zaha, Alli and Maguire were all more highly thought of than Barnes currently is when they were his age but despite years more development all are now what I would describe as average or 'middling', and I stress this does not make them bad players but standard or slightly better than standard Premier League players.

I do wish I hadn't used the term middling now, it's very broad and people really do seem to think that I'm trying to knock him by using it and I'm not. But to consistently reach the level some of you think he's gonna reach based on a very recent upturn in form seems a real stretch and he's far more likely to fall into the large bracket of players just below.

 

[Meat and 2 veg]

1 hour ago, An Sionnach said:

Our way of playing has changed so much . When we won the premiership we used Marc and Mahrez as wide players . That worked very well then obviously but our main strength now is down the middle and Albrighton just doesn't fit in .

With respect, when one winger gets 17 goals and 11 Assists, it takes the pressure of other attacking players who do not produce as much

[Guest An Sionnach]

5 minutes ago, Meat and 2 veg said:

With respect, when one winger gets 17 goals and 11 Assists, it takes the pressure of other attacking players who do not produce as much

True but Marc is a much better defender than Mahrez so made his contribution in other ways.

[Mike Oxlong]

He reminds me of my younger self when it comes to shooting. We could be described as similar players save that I didn’t have his attributes of pace and dribbling skill

Edited 3 February 2020 by Mike Oxlong

[Marshall Cockney Fox]

Harvey is a great talent, who hopefully will become a legend. But I think the knockers, whilst harsh, have a point re his weaknesses. For all the good bits, I think he has missed more 'sitters' than anyone else in the team this season. I'd love to see a conversion rate stat. As my instinct says it would be awful. Hopefully someone can iron out this obvious weakness in his game. If they do, boy will he be a threat.

[Xen]

We're blessed with two of the best finishers in the entire division this season in Vardy and Iheanacho. Barnes hasn't actually been that bad, but with that comparison the standard we set as fans is ridiculous sometimes and its hardly a surprise he hasn't quite hit those heights.

He's getting better, growing into his role and starting to get a lot more confidence in his play now. He's starting to find his shooting boots and a bit of momentum, and with a bit more consistency from Chilwell behind him he'll hopefully continue that development. He's got a half-decent chance of getting to double-figures for goals this season if he can keep his current form going, which for a home-grown youngster playing on the wing ain't half bad.

[rachhere]

He stood out more for me than Hudson Odoi, who of course is getting England caps. What did everyone else think?

[Fox92]

4 minutes ago, rachhere said:

He stood out more for me than Hudson Odoi, who of course is getting England caps. What did everyone else think?

Hudson Odoi seems to be another overhyped player to me. Obviously I only see Chelsea live twice a season but I've never seen him do anything to justify the hype around his name. Pretty sure nobody had heard of him untill he was linked with Bayern Munich (pretty sure it was them).

 

Not doubting he may become a good player but you've got someone like Grealish, who is basically dragging Villa himself, yet the one who plays for England, and constantly called for England, is Hudson Odoi.

 

Thought Barnes was good again Saturday. He came up against a young, highly rated full back too, and had the beating of him. As I said earlier in the week, Barnes seems to be in good form at the minute which is good to see.

 

Edited 3 February 2020 by Fox92

[Dorkingfox]

1 minute ago, Fox92 said:

Hudson Odoi seems to be another overhyped player to me. Obviously I only see Chelsea live twice a season but I've never seen him do anything to justify the hype around his name. Pretty sure nobody had heard of him untill he was linked with Bayern Munich (pretty sure it was them).

 

Not doubting he may become a good player but you've got someone like Grealish, who is basically dragging Villa himself, yet the one who plays for England, and constantly called for England, is Hudson Odoi.

 

Thought Barnes was good again Saturday. He came up against a young, highly rated full back too.

 

Southgate will always play the hyped Chelsea players, he is a useless manager.