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Jakemoore

The Super League

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10 minutes ago, foxfanazer said:

What like PES names? Spurs would be London Whites? 

If we can create our own players then it's a huge yes from me. Big 7ft 2 blonde monster with 100 pace, power and finishing and gives very peculiar interviews..... and people claim Dortmund aren't interested in this, they created it!!!

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1 minute ago, Webbo said:

Andy Burnham, the Mayor of Manchester has been vocally against the Super league. He needs to step up and at least threaten this.

If it's true of course. Hell of a threat too. Takes away a huge part of the branding. Most of the reason fifa computer games are more popular than pes is because of the shite names, I'd imagine the same would apply to real life football. 

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9 minutes ago, Dahnsouff said:

Like "Manchester United" you mean? In what world is it in the Government power to do so?

There's also the power the government have over local authorities with planning permissions, transport permissions etc. If they wanted to they could order the local authority to close every road and car park around old trafford.   

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Just now, yorkie1999 said:

There's also the power the government have over local authorities with planning permissions, transport permissions etc. If they wanted to they could order the local authority to close every road and car park around old trafford.   

I don't think that would be legal and rightly so. There has to be a better way. 

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14 minutes ago, ozleicester said:

While i understand the anger and agree with it... where was it in 1990 when the premier league first screwed the other clubs over?

I don’t think it’s comparable at all.
 

The premier league didn’t try to re-write one of the most fundamental and important aspects of football - sporting merit. 
 

The super league will be a closed system whereby no club outside of, what they believe to be the “elite clubs” (read marketable), can ever hope to climb the ladder and compete on that same level. The hypocrisy of Chelsea and Man City is most disgusting as they are now burning the very ladder they themselves scaled a few years ago.
 

This closed system is what makes the whole plan so abhorrent to every single person involved in the game. As soon as the sport removes reward based on sporting merit football as we know it dies.

 

It might sound dramatic, but the fact is we are right now in a fight to the death for football. If we lose it is frankly unthinkable what our sport could look like in the next couple of decades. 
 

I can only think that anyone who is not currently apoplectic with rage has failed to grasp the enormity of the situation. How we as football people react to this defines the future of football.

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1 minute ago, yorkie1999 said:

There's also the power the government have over local authorities with planning permissions, transport permissions etc. If they wanted to they could order the local authority to close every road and car park around old trafford.   

That is true, you could punish them by denying access via infrastructure restrictions, imposing costs for their use. However that punishing the fans, the businesses around the stadiums, these costs would be transferred via streaming services. Also as the pandemic has already shown, fans in grounds is an irrelevant inconvenience to the running of football club on a global marketplace :(

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I still believe this can be fixed, and government action is part of it.


- I think it’s been mentioned above or elsewhere; this action can be considered to fall foul of existing competition laws, so the participating clubs can be treated as a cartel.

 

- I’m normally dead set against windfall taxes, but they’re a distinct option here. Just make a law. We have a government of a sovereign country. £100m a month tax.

 

- Make it illegal to host a match from the ESL in this country. Again, we can make a law. Break up games half way through if needs be. The clubs need to organise them somehow. Just send police to break up any attempt to play.

 

- If at all possible, just take their assets. Take their stadiums. Hand them over to fans groups.

 

- Deny visas to players of any foreign ESL clubs who want to play matches here. Chase these “clubs” out. Deny them their identity. It’s already established in the courts that these clubs don’t have copyright over their names. New clubs can be set up by fans and their history assumed.

 

- I do think the threat to exclude players from international matches is needed, but I’d caveat it. I might allow the Euros to take place unhindered, for instance. But ultimately the cause is helped greatly if players can be extricated from this “league”. For instance, there’s likely some part of a player’s contract that depends on the recognition of their club as an actual, recognised football/sports club. If they’re no longer FIFA-sanctioned, I’d say all kinds of loopholes might appear. For instance, they might be able to sign up to another club as well. And don’t assume it’s all about money. What most players want is recognition. Deny them that in a ESL while granting them that in the real leagues and I’m confident most of them will be brought over.

 

- More than anything, don’t just wave your arms in the air and sigh “it’s going to happen”. Be creative. Ultimately, what these owners have is wads of money, companies and contracts that likely depend in part on being recognised by footballing authorities. Everything else can be chipped away at, and should be.

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2 minutes ago, Webbo said:

I don't think that would be legal and rightly so. There has to be a better way. 

Not saying they would do that, it's the threat of doing it, that's why it's important that the footballing powers issue a statement as to the consequences of creating a new league.

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12 minutes ago, spursfanstu said:

Spurs fan here who is cringing at our inclusion in this and wants no part of it. You deserve to be there more than we do on merit.

Nobody deserves to be there on merit, as merit is not at its core at all.

 

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22 minutes ago, Dahnsouff said:

The people backing this proposal are monsters, the actions you mention would become mired in legal challenges that take years to be heard and reach a conclusion. I have no doubt there is way more to this proposal then we are hearing, the marketing, the online presence, the finances, its all well established, this is not an overnight move, it has been long planned and I suspect that in some form it will actually occur.

I'm increasingly convinced this will happen. And unfortunately it will be profitable. The owners of these clubs really don't give a flying **** about what football fans think. Their target audience are the casual fans at best. We are going to have to readjust. Football life for us is going to be very different from now on. Possibly better in some ways. I'd like to think that I will NEVER watch any of these Super League matches. Maybe we won't have the best players playing the "best" football, but we will have a much better sport.

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1 minute ago, Webbo said:

I don't think that would be legal and rightly so. There has to be a better way. 

But the government is perfectly within its rights to refuse police resources for ESL games. And it can also refuse work permits for overseas players of English ESL clubs. Alternatively, it could simply introduce emergency legislation that banned English clubs from participating - given that Keir Starmer has already said that Labour would back such legislation, it would have no trouble getting into law.

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3 minutes ago, spursfanstu said:

Spurs fan here who is cringing at our inclusion in this and wants no part of it. You deserve to be there more than we do on merit.

With respect, I know that the "Big 6" is a well established thing before any of this happened and you've always been included in that but do you wonder if it didn't just stop at 4 or 5 English clubs joining the super league but became the six in order to preserve the 14-6 voting possibilities in the pending meetings regarding sanctions? There's some confusion as to whether 14 votes is enough or it needs to be three quarters i.e. 15?

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14 minutes ago, spursfanstu said:

Spurs fan here who is cringing at our inclusion in this and wants no part of it. You deserve to be there more than we do on merit.

Honestly, I just hope a way is found out of this that enables you to keep your club without your disgrace of an owner in charge. It’s not your fault as a fan what’s happened.

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I have a question. Although it may well be a load of crap, so please excuse my ignorance on these kinds of matters.

 

But if this does go ahead and if these teams do get kicked out of the league/cups by the Premier League and Uefa, does that mean that although the players will be registered with the 'Super League' teams, the FA may not recognise such a registration? So in their eyes they would essentially be a free agent? 

If so, does that mean in theory a player who wanted out of an ESL club (if they happened to not just be about money) could down tools and just sign for/register with a Premier League team on a free (within the free transfer window) and play straight away?

I get they would be in breach of contract with the ESL team, but could any action be taken other than sacking them? Or could any fine/legal costs be covered by the new signing on fee? (I suppose that could depend on salary and contract length remaining?) 

Of course that kind of thing can't happen in normal circumstances because the player couldn't register for two teams at the same time.

 

I just don't understand how any transfers to and from the ESL would take place with the normal process if the established FAs don't recognise this new 'competition' and presumably wouldn't accept player registrations for it if they no longer take part in their own league and cups.

If enough of the players wanted that, the clubs could lose lots of value.

 

Of course the worry is that if what I have said is not total rubbish (it probably is), the same could happen the other way with players going to the ESL for the £££.

 

I'm sure there is some massive flaw in what I have said, because it just seems too obvious a problem for it to not have been considered. Unless they think the FA wouldn't have the bottle?

 

Edit: I'm not saying the FA would refuse them registration, I just mean if hypothetically this new ESL is a separate entity and not recognised by Fifa etc. Like how players have played for Catalunya and Spain.

Of course the clubs wouldn't want that, but I'm referring to the possibility of a player being registered for both as the 'Associations' would not be related.

 

 

Edited by Aesc
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19 minutes ago, spursfanstu said:

Spurs fan here who is cringing at our inclusion in this and wants no part of it. You deserve to be there more than we do on merit.

True.. but as a Leicester fan i wouldn't want my club anywhere near the franchise league... glad we're not included.

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I know the PL are utter cnuts like but hearing folk cry foul over the 1992 breakaway is annoying. 

 

In the era of PL, clubs in 1992 whom were on the brink of falling into non league ascended through the divisions to play top flight football, winning competitions and play in Europe - Wigan, Swansea, Hull. The journey from bottom to top has been possible. 

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The longer this goes on the more I want it to happen. I'm incredibly curious to see if they can make it a success. I'd happily see the stupid finances in the game come down to a more acceptable level as well. The money being spent by clubs on trransfers and wages in this country is ridiculous.

 

The fans can follow new phoenix clubs and get the enjoyment of non league football for a few seasons.

 

I can't get my head around people think that the english football pyramid will collapse if 6 clubs leave it lol

 

Edited by filbertway
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If this goes ahead it will be pointless having the greedy 6 in the PL, their priorities would be elsewhere (if they are doing well in their other league you can guarantee they would play a weakened team for the PL game) so may need to bite the bullet and boot them out. In 10/15 years time , if it is a success commercially based on Asian and American subscriptions a lot of these games will end up being played there. ‘Legacy’ fans of these clubs will be shafted as they are not needed in the eyes of the owners. Manchester United and Liverpool may end up being successful but will grow detached from their cities. Needs to be killed off now though I think it’s gone too far already. These clubs would have game planned this, could end up in the courts but the damage done could be irreversible. 

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Just now, Cardiff_Fox said:

I know the PL are utter cnuts like but hearing folk cry foul over the 1992 breakaway is annoying. 

 

In the era of PL, clubs in 1992 whom were on the brink of falling into non league ascended through the divisions to play top flight football, winning competitions and play in Europe - Wigan, Swansea, Hull. The journey from bottom to top has been possible. 

It’s not even close to comparable, anyone making those parallels does not even understand why we are against it.

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