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Madeleine McCann

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2 hours ago, Wymeswold fox said:

It does seem like the press etc are siding with the McCann's, whilst some of the general feeling amongst us (on Foxestalk} looking at the situation as a general reader are edging towards the other way..

It has also appeared and still does appear that when as if somebody believes her parents were involved with it, others disagreeing with it get the hump about the hearsay (like theirs is, as well) and blame them for disrespect/lack of sympathy.

Which means sod all...

Like so many "conspiracy theories", no one will know the absolute truth apart from the perpetrators or, if surviving, the victim. Sadly, like Ben Needham, Madeleine hasn't lived to tell us what happened.

Hearsay is not admissible in evidence and I agree, there are those, not just on here but internationally, that will not accept the obvious and want to blame parents who made an innocent decision. Don't forget, that was not their first visit to that resort and they must have felt it was safe, otherwise I am sure, given their intellect, they wouldn't have left a 4 yr old alone.

Edited by Parafox
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6 hours ago, Babylon said:

One of my pet hates is conspiracy theorists and how they delve for inconsistencies as though they prove anything.

 

If you go out with friends for meal on holiday, have a few glasses of wine, then your daughter went missing sending your world into melt down, didn't sleep for 48 hours and then were expected to give an exact, minute by minute, consistent story of exactly what happened. Not only that but everyone then has to give an exact replica of that story when questioned time and time again over months and years, there would be more holes in the story than Fred Wests garden.

 

I couldn't even tell you what time I went to bed last night, let alone give a breakdown of my whole night, with precise details of what time I went toilet, what time I had dinner, what I or others were wearing blah blah.

that investigation fella even said that inconsistencies lead you to believe it’s the truth. 

 

like you’ve pointed out it would be a lot more suspicious if 8 tipsy adults all went away and came back a few days later with exact replicas of a story. even when you spend a night with your mates you probably all remember it differently anyway until someone points out what actually did happen etc. 

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Watched a few episodes last night.

 

Pretty clear what has happened.

 

Someone walked into the opened room and took Maddy, the parents discovered she was missing and so turned the place upside down to look for her in panic and ruined any possible evidence, the abductor had about 8 hours to get out of the country before local authorities started road checks etc. 

 

Poof, gone and won't ever be found.

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I just cant see it that if they accidently killed Maddie that they wouldn't have crumbled under the pressure from the police and media.

 

When do people actually think they moved the body?

 

Scenario A - All at the dinner table, Parent went up to check on kids and found Maddie not breathing, go back to the table, tell everyone what's happened, get rid of the body then create the abduction story.

 

Scenario B - Maddie has died before the meal, they have removed the body and hid it somewhere and conspired a story where they leave their kids in the rooms and the supposed abduction happens.

 

I'm interested to know at what point Maddie died, during the meal or beforehand

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5 minutes ago, kingcarr21 said:

I just cant see it that if they accidently killed Maddie that they wouldn't have crumbled under the pressure from the police and media.

 

When do people actually think they moved the body?

 

Scenario A - All at the dinner table, Parent went up to check on kids and found Maddie not breathing, go back to the table, tell everyone what's happened, get rid of the body then create the abduction story.

 

Scenario B - Maddie has died before the meal, they have removed the body and hid it somewhere and conspired a story where they leave their kids in the rooms and the supposed abduction happens.

 

I'm interested to know at what point Maddie died, during the meal or beforehand

It's crazy that people think they could have pulled off one of these scenarios, both of which are completely fanciful compared to scenario C - they leave the kids alone whilst eating out every night, and someone notices and takes the opportunity to snatch the child and flee immediately. Panic sets in when the child is discovered missing and in the initial confusion and chaos the abductor is already miles away

 

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Like others have said, the charity works for me seems a big lead that hasn't really been solved.

 

The conclusion I came to was that they were involved somehow. They have never been tracked down to provide an alibi. Seemed very unusual to me as their story did not check out.

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1 hour ago, kingcarr21 said:

I just cant see it that if they accidently killed Maddie that they wouldn't have crumbled under the pressure from the police and media.

 

When do people actually think they moved the body?

 

Scenario A - All at the dinner table, Parent went up to check on kids and found Maddie not breathing, go back to the table, tell everyone what's happened, get rid of the body then create the abduction story.

 

Scenario B - Maddie has died before the meal, they have removed the body and hid it somewhere and conspired a story where they leave their kids in the rooms and the supposed abduction happens.

 

I'm interested to know at what point Maddie died, during the meal or beforehand

Professional killers will slip up even when they have months to plan the perfect murder.

 

Yet the Mcanns managed to kill their daughter and and every off the cuff move after that seemed to be the perfect move and still evading the best investigator in 2 countries??

 

 

 

Edited by les-tah
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9 minutes ago, yorkie1999 said:

I know it's a heartless thing to put someone through but I wish they'd have taken a lie detector test, if only so that everyone involved in the case over the years could simply rule out the option of it being them and focus on an abduction.

"Lie detectors" aren't used by anyone, becasue they don't work. 

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8 minutes ago, yorkie1999 said:

I know it's a heartless thing to put someone through but I wish they'd have taken a lie detector test, if only so that everyone involved in the case over the years could simply rule out the option of it being them and focus on an abduction.

 

Lie detector tests aren't scientifically accurate and as far as I'm aware aren't used in criminal investigations.

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1 hour ago, yorkie1999 said:

So all those slappers that deny having sex with the guys brothers and uncles on Jeremy Kyle could have been telling the truth!

They aren't conclusive evidence. They say it has an accuracy of like 98%. So in court it would just be thrown out as the person accused of lying could just be in the 2% bracket. So police don't use it.

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1 hour ago, yorkie1999 said:

So all those slappers that deny having sex with the guys brothers and uncles on Jeremy Kyle could have been telling the truth!

My ex made me do one and it came back that I was lying which I wasn't and the woman who was doing it for me wasn't having any of it eventually she let me do it again and it came back as the truth lol

 

They simply are not accurate .. after she had a bit of a gone out look on her face funny 

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12 minutes ago, kingcarr21 said:

They aren't conclusive evidence. They say it has an accuracy of like 98%. So in court it would just be thrown out as the person accused of lying could just be in the 2% bracket. So police don't use it.

Better than a speed camera then. However, its not a court and if it's 98% accurate on one person, what's the chances of it picking up both parents not telling the truth.

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31 minutes ago, yorkie1999 said:

Better than a speed camera then. However, its not a court and if it's 98% accurate on one person, what's the chances of it picking up both parents not telling the truth.

Lie Detectors are nowhere near 98% accurate. 

 

There are not used in criminal cases either in the UK or Portugal.

 

There's no way that anyone would volunteer to undergo such a test in these circumstances. Even if they "passed" the test, the critics would say they "cheated" them.

 

 

 

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7 hours ago, AKCJ said:

Watched a few episodes last night.

 

Pretty clear what has happened.

 

Someone walked into the opened room and took Maddy, the parents discovered she was missing and so turned the place upside down to look for her in panic and ruined any possible evidence, the abductor had about 8 hours to get out of the country before local authorities started road checks etc. 

 

Poof, gone and won't ever be found.

It's not pretty clear though is it and to believe the abduction theory, it's meant to have been through the window which Kate herself says wasn't open before she went missing, which only has her fingerprints on it. Have an opinion on it all you want, but nothing is "clear" about this case because of the lack of evidence. The only clear thing about this case is how much of a balls up the portugese police did, took too long to go after the McCanns as suspects and by that point they'd exhausted pretty much all their options.

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44 minutes ago, The Horse's Mouth said:

It's not pretty clear though is it and to believe the abduction theory, it's meant to have been through the window which Kate herself says wasn't open before she went missing, which only has her fingerprints on it. Have an opinion on it all you want, but nothing is "clear" about this case because of the lack of evidence. The only clear thing about this case is how much of a balls up the portugese police did, took too long to go after the McCanns as suspects and by that point they'd exhausted pretty much all their options.

I don’t believe that the window was used in the abduction.

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I just finished watching this last night. 100% it's those 'Charity Collectors' and I am disappointed that we didn't get more details on the investigation into them. I assume there is an ongoing investigation, because no way did they not just move over to the surrounding resort areas - probably still operating up and down the Portuguese and Spanish coast with little trace. The 'Blonde guys' could have been anyone, but were probably involved with the charity collectors too, but with such few details on them, they would be much harder to find. 

 

I did get a bit swayed by the dogs, but the fact that the DNA could be anyone from family reversed my opinion. The blood dog finding something I am not surprised about. Someone could have had a cut on their hand and got a bag out of the car, leaving a small trace. And in the apartment, someone (or several people over the years) could easily have cut themselves, and it just wasn't cleaned up properly - I am pretty sure the cleaning companies don't bleach everything in between guests. I am not sure what the cadaver dog was smelling though and I guess we'll never know.

 

It was a really hard watch. I got quit freaked out when the woman came down the stairs after doing the laundry and found the guy downstairs with her daughter. I slept with the bedroom doors open last night, and reminds me of one of the reasons I've (largely) quit drinking. I've always been concerned that if I have too much to drink, would I fall into too a deep sleep and not hear an intruder, or something happen to the kids. And if I'd have had too much to drink, I wouldn't be able to drive them to the hospital etc.

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3 hours ago, Merging Cultures said:

I just finished watching this last night. 100% it's those 'Charity Collectors' and I am disappointed that we didn't get more details on the investigation into them. I assume there is an ongoing investigation, because no way did they not just move over to the surrounding resort areas - probably still operating up and down the Portuguese and Spanish coast with little trace. The 'Blonde guys' could have been anyone, but were probably involved with the charity collectors too, but with such few details on them, they would be much harder to find. 

 

I did get a bit swayed by the dogs, but the fact that the DNA could be anyone from family reversed my opinion. The blood dog finding something I am not surprised about. Someone could have had a cut on their hand and got a bag out of the car, leaving a small trace. And in the apartment, someone (or several people over the years) could easily have cut themselves, and it just wasn't cleaned up properly - I am pretty sure the cleaning companies don't bleach everything in between guests. I am not sure what the cadaver dog was smelling though and I guess we'll never know.

 

It was a really hard watch. I got quit freaked out when the woman came down the stairs after doing the laundry and found the guy downstairs with her daughter. I slept with the bedroom doors open last night, and reminds me of one of the reasons I've (largely) quit drinking. I've always been concerned that if I have too much to drink, would I fall into too a deep sleep and not hear an intruder, or something happen to the kids. And if I'd have had too much to drink, I wouldn't be able to drive them to the hospital etc.

The cadaver dog was smelling just that, cadaver odour, that's what they are trained to do.

When Gerry was asked why the dogs had signalled this he answered " ask the dogs". 

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