Fulham Fan In Peace - Ranieri and How

[Arriba Los Zorros]

10 hours ago, Fox In The Box 90 said:

How do you know how ANY of the players like Kante would have played under Pearson?

 

Obviously he built the squad but he didnt manage them to the title.

 

And since then hes basically done an awful job in all his other jobs.

 

Anyway whats the point in arguing. We won the league. All that matters

Yeah, exactly, ultimately they are just managers of our club, not supporters.

 

I'm sure they both have extremely fond memories of their time at Leicester as most fans have fond memories of both of their times here, but end of the day we move on and their combined efforts have helped set us up as an established PL team which is what we all craved and could barely expect a decade ago.

[Bob Weasel Fox]

2 hours ago, ttfn said:

I cannot believe how little credit people are willing to given Ranieri for the title win.

 

Pearson did a fantastic job but if anybody seriously thinks that we’d have broken the top 4 under him, let alone won the title, let alone won the title by 10 points then they need their heads examining.

 

Its almost as if people have bought so far into this jovial happy-go-lucky master media manager character Ranieri played that he’s seen as some clown who happened to be in the right place at the right time.

 

Putting to one side the fact that he handled the press brilliantly (something that I think is hugely overstated as a factor in our title success) he made a few absolutely critical tactical adjustments to Pearson’s sides.

 

1) 4-4-1-1. We all know about this, but he managed to find a formation in which we could get the most out of Mahrez’ genius and Vardy’s pace. Both had spent big chunks of the previous season on the bench - we look back on it now as if it were guaranteed that they were destined for greatness and whilst we could tell they were good players, they weren’t showing it. Nobody had any clue Albrighton could be as effective on the left either, now it’s seen by many as his best position.

2) Compact defence. Simplicity at its finest. Defend narrow, allow crosses into the box, let Wes and Huth head them

away. We barely conceded a goal between Christmas and mid-April. 

3) In game/season tactical switches - from the first 10 mins of the season (when he moved Mahrez from the left to the right to take advantage of the space PvA left behind him) through to bringing in Jeff for the Swansea home game via the full back switch and the half time subs at Watford, Ranieri’s tactics were spot on.

 

Was he lucky to inherit the squad? Of course he was and Pearson deserves enormous credit for assembling it and doing so much behind the scenes. 

 

I was pleased when we sacked Ranieri because he had totally lost the plot by then and I’m not surprised he’s failed at Fulham. But there’s a lot of people mis-remembering his absolutely critical part in the most unlikely sporting achievement of all time. Go back and read David Bevan’s book, for example, for a contemporaneous view of what was happening. We worshipped Ranieri because we knew what he was giving to the club. That his career has gone tits up since shouldn’t be used to re-write the past.

Superb post 

[NotTheMarketLeader]

18 hours ago, Vacamion said:

 

People are doing Claudio a bit of a disservice in here. 

 

Yes there was spirit and talent, but Ranieri has the tactical nous to swap DeLaet and Schlupp for Simpson and Fuchs, to play Okazaki as a half and half striker support and midfielder to allow us to play two in the middle and two wingers. 

 

He made clean sheets a priority and then changed the emphasis to 1-0 wins and defend at all costs, just when we needed it. 

 

He handled the media magnificently. 

 

I think Claudio was a massive part of our success. 

 

To pretend he somehow spawned it and anyone else would have won that league as a manager is fantasy. 

 

Yes he struggled after and yes he won't keep Fulham up but credit where it is due. 

 

 

Edit - the post above already said some of this whilst I was ponderously typing it in. 

This is the reality.

 

And he made Vardy the main man up the middle of the pitch; Pearson chopped and changed with him as Ric Flair says above, sometimes he was on the bench and sometimes he was on the wing ffs.

 

Anyone who doesn’t respect or more accurately understand the tactical input that Ranners made as stated above, is eiter thick / stupid / or has been reading idiotic posts on here for the last three years by those who choose to rewrite history. They do this I know not why.

 

Very very disappointing to see the lack of respect by some for a really great guy not to mention a lack of understanding of ****ing football ??‍♂️

[NotTheMarketLeader]

4 hours ago, Fox85 said:

Facts.

 

Ranieri won the league on the foundations of what nigel Pearson built and his back room staff. Our form actually clicked from the great escape the season before. Ranieri left all the training with Craig Shakespeare and didnt change anything.

 

After we won the league Ranieri sacked 65% of the backroom staff and then bought his own in and conducted his own training this ended in failure.

 

 

 

 

Garbage 

[Rusko187]

Will always be a legend to me, as tough as it was though it was the right decision to part company with him.

[moseeds]

A great leader always makes it look like success was achieved in spite of them.

 

That certainly applied to Ranieri in the league winning season. It was a real case study in leadership versus management. He seemed to trust the staff (playing & support) and guided with vision and key insights when needed throughout the season. The team itself had leaders throughout because of the journey they had individually come through. The planets aligned for a brief moment in time, and the result was spectacular - and it was because of Ranieri not in spite of him.

[Guest worth_the_wait]

As a few people have said above, we need to be very careful about (inadvertently) re-writing history.  You need to read contemporary accounts from the summer of 2016 to get the analysis of the 2015-16 season.

 

After that, we subconsciously factor in later events ... such as how disappointing the 2016-17 season was (apart from the Champions League run).   To say Ranieri "lost the plot" that season, it's too easy to think he couldn't have been that good in the first place.  He must've got lucky?  But that's re-writing history.

 

In my opinion, Ranieri had 2 superb attributes.

 

He was experienced enough at the highest level to know what to change (tweak, if you like), to get the best out of his inherited squad.  The changes he made were relatively small in the scheme of the Universe, but critical ones,

 

But I think his greatest attribute was his wisdom, in recognising a good thing when he saw it ... and leaving it alone.   99% of managers are programmed to change things, to make their mark, stamp their personality over the place.  No matter how good something inherited is, you can always make a mess of it.   Ask Peter Taylor!

 

Ranieri initially believed that the training wasn't right, and he wanted to push the players harder.   But he was persuaded to leave it alone and trust the sports people at the club.   It's to Ranieri's credit that he had the wisdom to realise that, and the humility to allow himself to be overruled.

 

 

[Sol thewall Bamba]

The best players we've ever had at the club, brought in and nurtured mostly by Pearson and his team. An unbreakable spirit, fostered by Pearson and his team. A totally savage will to win, installed by Pearson and his team. The best backroom set up we've ever had, put in place by Pearson and his team. 

 

These are facts. 

[Babylon]

Pearson played 4411 with inverted wingers for about 95% of the time he was here, bought a left back and a DM to fix the issues that made us convert to three at the back in the first place. Ranieri did plenty to earn lot of credit for the win, but it's stretching it to suggest that's all his idea.

[That_Dude]

7 hours ago, Fox85 said:

Facts.

 

Ranieri won the league on the foundations of what nigel Pearson built and his back room staff. Our form actually clicked from the great escape the season before. Ranieri left all the training with Craig Shakespeare and didnt change anything.

 

After we won the league Ranieri sacked 65% of the backroom staff and then bought his own in and conducted his own training this ended in failure.

 

 

 

 

lol@facts

[urban fox]

I agree with the posts that give credit to Pearson and his team for laying the foundations, however, it was Claudio that put the final pieces of the jigsaw together.  A lot of people are saying that it was pearson's team but Shinji, Fuchs, Kante, Simpson never played under Pearson. (that's 40% of the outfield). As previously stated Mahrez, was not the same player, often benched and certainly in the early days Pearson did not seem to favour Albrighton at all.

Despite this, Pearson does rightly deserve a lot of credit for the work he did but, it has to be said he was a bit erratic and he had a tendency to hit the self destruct button every now and then.  Similarly Ranieri did lose the plot somewhat.  So each in their turn did their own bit and the dream would not have come about without either of them.

[Tom12345]

A lot of good posts here (I only read the initial ones).

 

One crucial thing that was left out is the fact that the players got big headed.

 

Without Kante, there was a big missing piece of the puzzle that was obvious and difficult to replace. It left our defence exposed - Huth and Morgan were found out. Together with Simpson, they could only hoff it upfield most of the time. This meant that we lost control of the ball all the time not for any genuine counterattacking purpose but merely for safety and hope. It was ugly to watch. Kante used to protect these three defenders and allowed play to move up quickly to the likes of Vardy and Mahrez. It also meant that Albrington and Drinkwater can usefully contribute as otherwise they could not do much when our defenders by pass them with route one football.

 

Ranieri saw that in fairness. He needed to change something. He either didn’t know how to or he could not execute because he had to

then deal with a bunch of players with big heads and a backroom staff who didn’t support him (eg. Shakespeare).  Either way, he couldn’t solve this problem and we were heading towards relegation.

[moseeds]

6 hours ago, Sol thewall Bamba said:

The best players we've ever had at the club, brought in and nurtured mostly by Pearson and his team. An unbreakable spirit, fostered by Pearson and his team. A totally savage will to win, installed by Pearson and his team. The best backroom set up we've ever had, put in place by Pearson and his team. 

 

These are facts. 

 

They are all correct and Pearson gets a lot of credit for the title winning team. But great infrastructure or players isn't enough. Look at Man Utd, Real Madrid, et al - you need a visionary leader to see you through the good times but especially the rocky times. Ranieri was a magician in that moment.

[TJB-fox]

On 28/02/2019 at 15:49, Vacamion said:

 

People are doing Claudio a bit of a disservice in here. 

 

Yes there was spirit and talent, but Ranieri has the tactical nous to swap DeLaet and Schlupp for Simpson and Fuchs, to play Okazaki as a half and half striker support and midfielder to allow us to play two in the middle and two wingers. 

 

He made clean sheets a priority and then changed the emphasis to 1-0 wins and defend at all costs, just when we needed it. 

 

He handled the media magnificently. 

 

I think Claudio was a massive part of our success. 

 

To pretend he somehow spawned it and anyone else would have won that league as a manager is fantasy. 

 

Yes he struggled after and yes he won't keep Fulham up but credit where it is due. 

 

 

Edit - the post above already said some of this whilst I was ponderously typing it in. 

Agreed mate. Very easy to slag him off (no idea why any lcfc fan would want to)  now he’s been sacked by ourselves and Fulham. Was fantastic here and deserves to be remembered rightly. Didn’t work out the following year but that’s football. 

[smr]

9 hours ago, Ric Flair said:

Pearson has never managed the media well, even with all the well wishing we got from being up there from Christmas onwards I still think there'd have been some friction between him and the press. That could have then got to the players eventually, it completely defied science what we did as an underdog in team sport for that length of time. Usually pressure eventually gets to the plucky challengers but under Ranieri it seemed to spur us on. It was the greatest piece of management I've ever seen, he has to take full credit for that, it was genius. We musn't forget as well this was from a a nearly man who had missed out on so many titles before, yet he kept everyone ice cool. Phenomenal.

Exactly. That's what I was getting at in my post but perhaps not making it clear enough... but that's why I mentioned the "maybe" in italics and went on to write about Ranieri's exceptional media mangagement... in other words, I agree with you, and I'm not sure whether Pearson could have dealt with the pressure the same way, we saw him crack with less pressure so you might come to your own conclusions about that...

 

Looking back, it really was perfect, we had a manager who built a LOT of the foundation and stability, and then we just needed someone to come along and manage the last part of the journey. Both men did their jobs as outstandingly as it gets.

[OhYesNdidi]

His trajectory as a manager since 2015/16 just shows how incredible that season really was 

 

failed with the Greece national team, didn’t they lose to the Faroe Islands? Lasted about a week.

 

the football he had us playing in the 16/17 was turgid at the best of times. We were barely able to string 3 or 4 passes together.

 

not sure how he got on at Nantes, but I doubt he pulled up any trees as he was sacked or he left.

 

Fulham .. sacked.

 

always be a legend for 15/16 but this perception of Claudio by media and the wider football community that he’s a great manager and every time he gets sacked is unjust or someone or things else’ fault etc is strange. I see Fulham are getting the same comments we got when he was sacked at LCFC.

 

Does anyone else agree or disagree? 

[The whole world smiles]

People are quick to bring up Claudio's poor record since like it somehow proves that it was all Nigel in 15/16. 

 

But what does big niges horrific time at Derby and OHL tell us?

[Dr The Singh]

Just now, The whole world smiles said:

People are quick to bring up Claudio's poor record since like it somehow proves that it was all Nigel in 15/16. 

 

But what does big niges horrific time at Derby and OHL tell us?

It s funny old game

[volpeazzurro]

12 hours ago, NotTheMarketLeader said:

This is the reality.

 

And he made Vardy the main man up the middle of the pitch; Pearson chopped and changed with him as Ric Flair says above, sometimes he was on the bench and sometimes he was on the wing ffs.

 

Anyone who doesn’t respect or more accurately understand the tactical input that Ranners made as stated above, is eiter thick / stupid / or has been reading idiotic posts on here for the last three years by those who choose to rewrite history. They do this I know not why.

 

Very very disappointing to see the lack of respect by some for a really great guy not to mention a lack of understanding of ****ing football ??‍♂️

100% agree and anyone who can't see the changes he made and how absolutely instrumental they were in our success has to be completely blinkered. Not that I'm disrespecting NP because he did a very good job for us overall but he can't really be compared to Ranieri. I feel sorry for the latter as he inherited a mess at Fulham, a story which proves yet again that big spending doesn't necessarily bring success. We should have a lot of respect for Ranieri did and I remember his tenure fondly, what an absolutely incredible time we all had.

[Trav Le Bleu]

Two words.

 

Buddhist monks.

[HighPeakFox]

2 hours ago, OhYesNdidi said:

Does anyone else agree or disagree? 

Almost certainly  

[Stadt]

On 28/02/2019 at 15:16, AjcW said:

 

 

END THREAD....

Weird seeing him in the 16/17 kit 

[Hanan96]

We won the title not because of Ranieri alone, or Pearson, but everybody combined together. 

[ThaiFox]

32 minutes ago, Hanan96 said:

We won the title not because of Ranieri alone, or Pearson, but everybody combined together. 

Completely right.

 

Both deserve equal credit for that season. 

 

Ranieri would not have won us the title without the squad and spirit already in place. He hasn't built a title winning squad at any of  the clubs he's managed, not even the biggest clubs he's managed.

 

It's impossible to say if Pearson would have won us the P/L title. But we know tactically he wasn't good enough in that first P/L season, and hasn't been since leaving us. He certainly knew how to build spirit a squad and an outstanding backroom team though, which is why it's as much Pearson's title as Ranieri's.

 

Surely anyone can see it was a factor of these two combinations together and for just one season which resulted in that achievement?

 

 

[wokinghamfox]

I would love to hear what Shakie and Walsh thought of Raneri both tactically and how his man management was. I cant change my opinion that he just totally followed Pearsons lead and was just about a tweak here and there.