Ukraine

[Leicesterpool]

It's got to a point where now. Putin's is destroying Ukraine. But even if  his quest is successful. The damage caused theyll be nothing left for his suppose new regime there. After this war Russia will be at there weakest. With the troops lost, weapons used and destroyed, aircrafts destroyed, finance wasted and now huge sanctions from the west. 

[ClaphamFox]

 

[String fellow]

1 minute ago, ClaphamFox said:

 

Shocking that it was even attempted. This shows the world what sort of person Putin really is. Hitler II.

[turkish14]

I think as hard as it is now to witness destruction and lives being lost, I do think the Ukrainian military and leaders know what they are doing, and feel very confident it’s about to get much worse for the Russian military.

 

The question is, how will this impact on Putin and what will he then do. 

[Guest Lako42]

That Russian convoy is less reliable than those from WW2. Putin must be so proud. 

 

 

[Aleksz]

The Russians would have got to Kyiv quicker on foot than that convoy, they’ve been “on the outskirts” for about 4 days 

[yorkie1999]

5 minutes ago, Aleksz said:

The Russians would have got to Kyiv quicker on foot than that convoy, they’ve been “on the outskirts” for about 4 days 

Maybe, just maybe, what we're being fed isn't actually true. 

[RoboFox]

56 minutes ago, ClaphamFox said:

 

I read somewhere that Danilov went on to say that dissenting members of the FSB who don't agree with the war tipped off the Ukrainian intelligence services. 

 

Incredible if true. If Putin is losing the FSB, his time is surely coming to an end. 

[ClaphamFox]

2 minutes ago, RoboFox said:

I read somewhere that Danilov went on to say that dissenting members of the FSB who don't agree with the war tipped off the Ukrainian intelligence services. 

 

Incredible if true. If Putin is losing the FSB, his time is surely coming to an end. 

Yes I read that too. It's not surprising that there are some folk within the Russian administration who understand the insanity and recklessness of what Putin is doing. The question is: how many of them are there and will they be in a position to stop him?

Edited 2 March 2022 by ClaphamFox

[Daggers]

1 hour ago, Julian Joachim Jr Shabadoo said:

 

A powerful image... of how terrible some people's Photoshop abilities are

I like these

[Zear0]

10 minutes ago, Daggers said:

I like these

[st albans fox]

1 hour ago, Leicesterpool said:

It's got to a point where now. Putin's is destroying Ukraine. But even if  his quest is successful. The damage caused theyll be nothing left for his suppose new regime there. After this war Russia will be at there weakest. With the troops lost, weapons used and destroyed, aircrafts destroyed, finance wasted and now huge sanctions from the west. 

if Russia aren’t committing their strongest troops and weapons/aircraft then that may not be the case ref their military capacity 

[Sampson]

5 minutes ago, Zear0 said:

Hitler was TIME person of the year as well (and Stalin too), so that's still in line with the photoshop!

Edited 2 March 2022 by Sampson

[filbertway]

1 hour ago, Col city fan said:

Finally, someone drew the comparison with Putin and Hitler

[Zear0]

5 minutes ago, Sampson said:

Hitler was TIME person of the year as well (and Stalin too), so that's still in line with the photoshop!

I didn't know that about Hitler.  Such a weird thing for them to do.

[CosbehFox]

2 hours ago, Finnegan said:

 

People believe what their media tells them, by and large.

 

How many lies are told in the average election campaign? How many lies were told in the Brexit campaign? How many lies has Donald Trump really blatantly told but he's still got legions of fanatical supporters?

 

Sure, there's plenty of cynical Russians that don't actually trust their state rhetoric but there's also plenty more that are stirred up by the patriotic rabble rousing and believe the party line that the rest of the world hates Russia and is lying about Russia. 

 

Plenty of Chinese citizens leave China to travel, study, etc, where they suddenly get access to all the information that they were denied using censored internet in their own country and absolutely stacks of them just see it all as lies and anti-China propaganda. You can show them articles about Tiananmen, Hong Kong, et all and they'll just repeat the CCP line back to you about how it's all fake and lies to bring down China. 

 

Jesus, all I've got to do is tie Brexit in to one of these posts and a bunch of Leavers will STILL jump in here getting upset that I compared Farage & Boris lying to Putin, or telling me that both sides lied, that Brexit would have worked if it wasn't for COVID or whatever other bollocks because they're still brainwashed.

 

Never underestimate the power of a good propaganda machine. 

In combination, a Russian middle class has been created and they can participate in capitalism (and holidays) albeit on their country's terms. They believe that's Putin's creation and what he's done for them. 

 

I think it's underestimated how much of a mess it was post Soviet break down. Lawless, under controlled and no economy. When you have that as your starting point, it's easy to build propaganda. 

[CosbehFox]

5 minutes ago, Zear0 said:

I didn't know that about Hitler.  Such a weird thing for them to do.

Germany was incredibly divided post WW1. It's difficult to actually get your head around it - they had a political landscape that was encouraging democracy yet its population still believed in a Kaiser monarchy system (Black Reichswehr for example ), had decent numbers of communists/socialists (which were even subdivided with themselves due to the Russian revolution) and grave poverty. If you read up on it all, it's difficult to keep up with and it becomes easier to see why Hitler found it easy to convince. There's a huge similarity with Putin there in their ability to unite from a really dire economic/national point in history. 

Edited 2 March 2022 by Cardiff_Fox

[Zear0]

Just now, Cardiff_Fox said:

Germany was incredibly divided post WW1. It's difficult to actually get your head around it - they had a political landscape that was encouraging democracy yet its population still believed in a Kaiser monarchy system, had decent numbers of communists (which were even subdivided with themselves due to the Russian revolution) and grave poverty. If you read up on it all, it's difficult to keep up with and it becomes easier to see why Hitler found it easy to convince. There's a huge similarity with Putin there in their ability to unite from a really dire economic/national point in history. 

Apologies, meant weird that Time still do "person of the year" as it's masturbatory ego massaging for whoever gets it.

 

But agree with what you've put.  The parallels between the two is pretty frightening and as sanctions bite and their media bites, it will either be a revolutionary moment, or drive a wedge deeper between "the west" and Russia.

[Guesty]

17 minutes ago, Cardiff_Fox said:

In combination, a Russian middle class has been created and they can participate in capitalism (and holidays) albeit on their country's terms. They believe that's Putin's creation and what he's done for them. 

 

I think it's underestimated how much of a mess it was post Soviet break down. Lawless, under controlled and no economy. When you have that as your starting point, it's easy to build propaganda. 

That last sentence is very true. When you research it, you can understand why he's so revered in Russia. But I do wonder with those very same people. How much have they become used to those luxuries? Those luxuries are all going to disappear now.

 

As the truth comes out, it could help his downfall.

Edited 2 March 2022 by Guesty

[purpleronnie]

[MPH]

2 hours ago, The Fox Covert said:

Course I have. I know a few ex-servicemen and none of them liked being sent to Northern Ireland and the prospect of fighting people who speak the same-ish language and have a partly shared culture. The Troubles were beyond bad but they were nothing like what went on a generation previous. Read about the Mau Mau rebellion in Kenya.

 

but British servicemen did still shoot at the Irish was my point.

[SpacedX]

1 hour ago, ClaphamFox said:

Yes I read that too. It's not surprising that there are some folk within the Russian administration who understand the insanity and recklessness of what Putin is doing. The question is: how many of them are there and will they be in a position to stop him?

As I suggested yesterday, the ending of the politburo was concerning.  

[casablancas]

1 hour ago, RoboFox said:

I read somewhere that Danilov went on to say that dissenting members of the FSB who don't agree with the war tipped off the Ukrainian intelligence services. 

 

Incredible if true. If Putin is losing the FSB, his time is surely coming to an end. 

I’ve heard the same 🤷‍♂️

[casablancas]

1 hour ago, st albans fox said:

if Russia aren’t committing their strongest troops and weapons/aircraft then that may not be the case ref their military capacity 

They’ve already ‘apparently’ had several Spetsnaz units infiltrate and be caught, as well as several units of paras.  Their pretty elite as my understanding goes. They’ve also has a fair number of seasoned and hardened chechneyan groups, admittedly they got blasted to the stone age. 

[gerblod]

1 hour ago, ClaphamFox said:

Yes I read that too. It's not surprising that there are some folk within the Russian administration who understand the insanity and recklessness of what Putin is doing. The question is: how many of them are there and will they be in a position to stop him.

The climate change issue has precedence over any other.

What we're seeing in this Russian attack on Ukraine is huge environmental damage - to lose sight of that, to diminish it, is leaving aside one other crime which this warmonger is guilty of. If he decided to employ battlefield tactical nuclear devices to finish the takeover then the environmental damage will be exponentially huge - akin to Hiroshima and Nagasaki. 

I suspect, when the sanctions bite, his position will become untenable. An already impoverished population might finally have had enough of his reactionary nonsense and the functionaries around him might or will usher him out the back door.

London is the centre of Russian money laundering - so Johnson has a decision to make. Whether to prosecute the pursuit and consfication of this money. Easy if you're moral by nature and strong willed enough, but, as with Ukrainian refugees, he's fence-sitting. I suspect he identifies with wealthy Eastern - far and middle - oligarchs and princes who've funded his party in return for him and Cameron turning a blind eye to their activities.

I surmise we'll put our own wellbeing before the Ukraine's. For our environment we really need to emulate the Scandinavian countries and Germany in terms of environmental responsibility - in using less power rather than aspiring to ever more consumer activity. That might knock China back significantly, in its global business expansion.

Me, I'd take Zelensky as the leader of this country over the buffoon doing PM impressions. And where's Angela Merkel when she's needed. I'd feel far more reassured with her around.

 

Edited 2 March 2022 by gerblod
Errant word