Harvey Barnes - West Brom (loan)

[Al-aLondon-Foxile]

4 minutes ago, Marshall Cockney Fox said:

If Gray had in anyway developed into the player we hoped, there would be no need to rush Harvey back. However his cameo yesterday showed again that - he is not the Messiah Harvey is!!!, no he's a naughty boy! 

Better 

[Babylon]

7 minutes ago, Marshall Cockney Fox said:

If Gray had in anyway developed into the player we hoped, there would be no need to rush Harvey back. However his cameo yesterday showed again that - he is not the Messiah. Harvey is!!!

He's been pathetic lately, the abuse Ghazzel gets yet he's still out performed Gray.

[Captain...]

34 minutes ago, Ric Flair said:

So the inclusion of Barnes was only going to be worthwhile if it was in the FA Cup? That would be exactly why he should stay at West Brom if we were only going to use him sparingly. This knee jerk reaction that our season is now over because we are out of both cups just shows how ridiculous our fan base has got. I know we won the league and we all buy in to the ambition our owners present to us but let's stop behaving like Arsenal fans. It's a pisser we went out yesterday and it's even more of a pisser we whiffed out of the League Cup when Man City seemed there for the taking but we chose to go with a weaker side. We knew they had a lengthy injury list but we chose to match them with changes and although we came close to getting through it was a needless show of generosity and we'd now have Burton in the semi's. However, that's gone now so we look to the future and we are in a position to finish our 2nd highest ever in the Premier League. Fans can turn their noses up at 7th and yes, in terms of tangible success it means the square root of fcuk all but it would be our 2nd best finish and if we calm down and assess that then it's a real indictment of improvement. If we can get north of 55 points then it's a really good season for us and a sound base to progress from. Should we nose dive now, like we did from a similar position last year then I will be as disgusted as the rest of our fans are right now but it isn't season over as our whole season cannot be based around two cup competitions, it's nonsensical.

 

Hmmmmm I think half a season being fully integrated in to the first team when we have absolutely no danger of relegation and the perfect environment for Barnes to prosper is very beneficial to both club and player. I am loving what he's doing at West Brom and yes if he stays there then hopefully he will continue in the vein he has done and come back with double figures for goals and assists and be one of the hottest properties in English football, however we are desperate for him ourselves if we want to give ourselves the best shot at finishing the season strongly. We have very little options across attacking midfield, out wide and up front. Are we going to go and buy another winger? Unlikely and even if we do, if they play where Barnes plays then that stunts his growth next season. Get him back and give him a 6 month free hit at settling in, just like it took Chilwell. He would be perfect in this 4-3-3 formation against the better sides and gives us a potential lock picker against stubborn and defensive teams, I cannot stomach watching the current mob any longer.

I’m not saying the season is over, but having 3 or 4 more Cup games for Puel to play with would be beneficial to figuring out the best way to use Barnes and the rest of the squad. 

 

There are still so many question marks over our forwards, I still think Nacho and Gray are good footballers if used correctly and get a decent run. Okazaki is not going to be effective in this style, but he still has qualities we can use. Albrighton and Okazaki are 3 of the hardest working players you could ask for and would excel with a high pressing line. They are not the sort of players you want if you’re aim is to retain possession. If we had a settled team and a plan A and Plan B that were both functioning then it is easier to see how Barnes would come in to the team, at the moment we chop and change so much on the front line that I don’t know our best side. Too many question marks over players, manager, style and formation for me.

 

If we go 433 for the rest of the season, Barnes, Vardy, Gray first choice then yes bring him back, but not if we’re going to recall him to play left wing in 4231 where he needs to track back one week, right wing in a 433 with Albrighton on the left the next then first change at 10 for Maddison in a 4231. 

 

We will have a bunch of friendly games preseason to try things out, between now and then I would rather questions over Nacho, Gray, Ghezzal were answered than more variables introduced.

[Captain...]

31 minutes ago, Nod.E said:

It's a good sentiment, but if our management team truly believe in him then all it takes is a frank conversation and the reassurance that he's in our plans regardless of how well the rest of the season goes. 

It's unlikely that he will hit the ground running and a bedding in period would be beneficial. I'd rather him come in this season, underwhelm and then kick on from next season when we have something to play for, than be thrown in at the deep end from the first game and be expected to switch it on.

Why would he be thrown in at the deep end next season? He will have a full preseason and friendlies to integrate into the squad and earn his place. There will be much less pressure on him at the start of next season, he can make a few sub appearances at the start and if he’s good enough he’ll soon be first choice. If not he can go on loan to a lower prem club in Jan.

 

You cut short his loan and deprive him of 20 odd games experience you are putting pressure on him to perform and Puel to play him, then there is the impact on players like Gray and Ghezzal who may find their chances further limited and if Barnes is struggling but still getting picked ahead of Gray then that will have a negative impact on the squad.

 

Obviously if Barnes comes back and tears it up, if he’s the missing piece in Puel’s plan and we go unbeaten to the end of the season then great. I just see a team lacking in stability and throwing in another variable could have a number of negative consequences .

[DANGEROUS TIGER]

10 minutes ago, Captain... said:

Why would he be thrown in at the deep end next season? He will have a full preseason and friendlies to integrate into the squad and earn his place. There will be much less pressure on him at the start of next season, he can make a few sub appearances at the start and if he’s good enough he’ll soon be first choice. If not he can go on loan to a lower prem club in Jan.

 

You cut short his loan and deprive him of 20 odd games experience you are putting pressure on him to perform and Puel to play him, then there is the impact on players like Gray and Ghezzal who may find their chances further limited and if Barnes is struggling but still getting picked ahead of Gray then that will have a negative impact on the squad.

 

Obviously if Barnes comes back and tears it up, if he’s the missing piece in Puel’s plan and we go unbeaten to the end of the season then great. I just see a team lacking in stability and throwing in another variable could have a number of negative consequences .

I think we would be putting too much pressure on the young lad if we brought him back now. Let him finish the learning process where he is, and bring him home in the summer.

[TonyN11]

27 minutes ago, Captain... said:

I’m not saying the season is over, but having 3 or 4 more Cup games for Puel to play with would be beneficial to figuring out the best way to use Barnes and the rest of the squad. 

 

There are still so many question marks over our forwards, I still think Nacho and Gray are good footballers if used correctly and get a decent run. Okazaki is not going to be effective in this style, but he still has qualities we can use. Albrighton and Okazaki are 3 of the hardest working players you could ask for and would excel with a high pressing line. They are not the sort of players you want if you’re aim is to retain possession. If we had a settled team and a plan A and Plan B that were both functioning then it is easier to see how Barnes would come in to the team, at the moment we chop and change so much on the front line that I don’t know our best side. Too many question marks over players, manager, style and formation for me.

 

If we go 433 for the rest of the season, Barnes, Vardy, Gray first choice then yes bring him back, but not if we’re going to recall him to play left wing in 4231 where he needs to track back one week, right wing in a 433 with Albrighton on the left the next then first change at 10 for Maddison in a 4231. 

 

We will have a bunch of friendly games preseason to try things out, between now and then I would rather questions over Nacho, Gray, Ghezzal were answered than more variables introduced.

Did you mean Albrighton and Kante?

[Dan]

If we bring him back and don't make him a first choice player then we are mugs, plain and simple. He has a good loan situation at West Brom, almost ideal in-fact, to sacrifice that to then not play him would be ridiculous on our part. He needs to come back and actually start games.

 

Given the performance of the others I think he comes back. It's a risk but it's one worth taking, I'd consider then sending Diabate to West Brom. I do actually think there's a talent in Diabate but he's gone well off the boil after a promising start. Can't see WBA being too happy but they ultimately agreed to a deal where we had the power to exercise this, and we've got proper reasons to.

[Ric Flair]

18 minutes ago, Captain... said:

Why would he be thrown in at the deep end next season? He will have a full preseason and friendlies to integrate into the squad and earn his place. There will be much less pressure on him at the start of next season, he can make a few sub appearances at the start and if he’s good enough he’ll soon be first choice. If not he can go on loan to a lower prem club in Jan.

 

You cut short his loan and deprive him of 20 odd games experience you are putting pressure on him to perform and Puel to play him, then there is the impact on players like Gray and Ghezzal who may find their chances further limited and if Barnes is struggling but still getting picked ahead of Gray then that will have a negative impact on the squad.

 

Obviously if Barnes comes back and tears it up, if he’s the missing piece in Puel’s plan and we go unbeaten to the end of the season then great. I just see a team lacking in stability and throwing in another variable could have a number of negative consequences .

You seem to be picturing the worst case scenario though for him. Maybe he comes back and performs like Choudhury has done. These kids are fearless, they arent riddled with the same mental scars that get carried along as baggage as players get older. I know you are raising some very good points but it simply comes down to the fact our alternatives right now are poor and I'm interested to see him get the rest of the season to bed in.

 

In terms of player development how you describe it above, is he going to progress more by playing another 20 games for West Brom and then starting as a bit part player next season, where he could easily fall out of favour and then go on loan again or if he comes back and makes 12+ starts in the PL, learns how to fit in to our system and feels integrated as a Premier League player for the rest of the season. Then after a full pre-season, he's one of the first names on the team sheet with half a seasons PL experience to refer to?

[Dan]

53 minutes ago, Babylon said:

He's been pathetic lately, the abuse Ghazzel gets yet he's still out performed Gray.

Gray's always gotten away with it for some reason. We've sneered at people like Townsend but I'd bet good money he's considerably outperformed Gray.

[mozartfox]

2 minutes ago, Dan LCFC said:

If we bring him back and don't make him a first choice player then we are mugs, plain and simple. He has a good loan situation at West Brom, almost ideal in-fact, to sacrifice that to then not play him would be ridiculous on our part. He needs to come back and actually start games.

 

Given the performance of the others I think he comes back. It's a risk but it's one worth taking, I'd consider then sending Diabate to West Brom. I do actually think there's a talent in Diabate but he's gone well off the boil after a promising start. Can't see WBA being too happy but they ultimately agreed to a deal where we had the power to exercise this, and we've got proper reasons to.

Personally, I am not bothered what West Brom think.  Our Team needs all the help they can muster in terms of creativity and goals.  Get him back and if his performance in training warrants it, play him.    What West Brom think is totally and utterly irrelevant.  

[siraaj_lcfc]

1 hour ago, Marshall Cockney Fox said:

I was all for leaving him at WBA. But our attacking options are so poor currently I don't think we can now. He is on form so really should be guaranteed a bench spot at worst, but will likely play many games. After all who is he competing with?

 

Nacho - nah

Ninja - beyond cooked

Gray - delusional

Ghezzal - errr?

Diabate - who?

 

He will get plenty of mins even if he's only half as good as his WBA form suggests.

 

I think we should bring him back and send Diabate to WBA in his place. Hes not much good here at the moment.

[daverollo]

I was all for letting him continue his development at WBA, especially with how well he has been performing and the fact that his opportunity at Leicester this season would be limited.

 

However, surely their is a massive window of opportunity for him now back at Leicester.  If we continue with 4231 or 433 then the wide left position is very much up for grabs IMO.

 

In a 4231 you can only really say that Maddison in the middle should be nailed on.  You then really only have, presently:

- Albrighton, no doubting his commitment and attitude on the pitch, but has to bring his A game to stand a chance of delivering the required quality needed.

- Gray, has made improvements this season, especially on the defensive side of things, but still little end product on a consistent basis.

- Ghezzal, flatters to deceive in wide areas.

- Diabetes - needs a loan to get more game time, no idea what has happened to him this season

- Riccardo, arguably our most effective wide man and he's meant to be a right back, can see him playing here more often if Amartey gets back soon, but would rather him play right back if we had better options ahead of him.

 

If Barnes could get 10+ games between now and the end of the season then surely playing against premiership opposition will make him better prepared for next season providing he can get the game time.

 

I would hope the Leicester faithful would get right behind him if he were to return, very much like Chilwell last season 

 

 

[Guest Bob Hazels shorts]

Season is over.

 

If Barnes is recalled by Puel it will be an absolute crime.

 

The lad is loving his role in a successful team that recognize his strengths, develop them and play to those.

 

Koko will have him at right back

[Nicolo Barella]

 

1 hour ago, Marshall Cockney Fox said:

If Gray had in anyway developed into the player we hoped, there would be no need to rush Harvey back. However his cameo yesterday showed again that - he is not the Messiah. Harvey is!!!

Gray is basically a really, really shit Hazard. Technically fancy but not enough end product.

[Buce]

2 hours ago, Captain... said:

We now have 17 games left, 6 against teams that are much better than us and could give us a right tonking (I know we beat Chelsea and Man City recently hence could, but we changed the formation and style up massively to do so) we have 7 or 8 games against teams fighting for survival some will park the bus and set up to frustrate us others will be fired up and go for a high pressing approach which leaves 3 or 4 “normal” games to play in Watford, Wolves, Bournemouth, West Ham. We saw last season how bad we were against struggling teams in the second half of the season, we lacked motivation they were fighting for their lives. We surrendered 7th place. 

 

Realistically 7th is our peak this season and we are currently there, the only way is down. If Barnes comes back and our results and performances mirror last season it will be a waste of time.

 

If he stays at West Brom they have at least 23 games left possibly more with FA Cup and playoffs. He will get more football, more stability and more confidence. 

 

Obviously he he could come back galvanise the team and inspire us to a top 6 finish, but based on last season and this he is more likely to be isolated and frustrated playing a 4231 where he doesn’t see enough of the ball when he does it is too slow to get to him and he is crowded out.

 

If he stays at West Brom he will come back buzzing and ready to prove himself in preseason to show he deserves to start. Come back now he has to quickly adjust to playing in a team that can’t decide from one week to the next if it is better than Chelsea and Man City or worse than Cardiff and Newport.

 

Trying to integrate with a stable team is hard enough but our Jekyll and Hyde performances mean we are still trying to figure out our best team over a year into Puel’s tenure.

 

Yeah, but we don’t want him cup-tied...

 

Oh, wait...

[Fox92]

I was 100% behind leaving him at WBA to continue his development but I do think he'd get in our starting team now. We lack everything he provides WBA.... assists, goals, a threat from midfield.

[Ric Flair]

24 minutes ago, Bob Hazels shorts said:

Season is over.

 

If Barnes is recalled by Puel it will be an absolute crime.

 

The lad is loving his role in a successful team that recognize his strengths, develop them and play to those.

 

Koko will have him at right back

But you'd have called him back if we were still in the FA Cup?

[Dan]

58 minutes ago, mozartfox said:

Personally, I am not bothered what West Brom think.  Our Team needs all the help they can muster in terms of creativity and goals.  Get him back and if his performance in training warrants it, play him.    What West Brom think is totally and utterly irrelevant.  

I do agree. He's our player and we have every right to call him back.

[Lambert09]

I think this should only happen if the manager thinks he is a better option than both Gray & Ghezzal. If not, then he really should stay out on loan. 

[MPH]

1 hour ago, Bob Hazels shorts said:

Season is over.

 

If Barnes is recalled by Puel it will be an absolute crime.

 

The lad is loving his role in a successful team that recognize his strengths, develop them and play to those.

 

Koko will have him at right back

 

 

The season is far far from Over.

 

 

We have the chance to qualify for European  competition if we finish 7th. we’re 7th.

[Stadt]

Ghezzal - not impressed with us, Monaco fans weren't keen, played under Puel and even he doesn't trust him to start.

Gray - never produced goals and assists constantly, had a mediocre record even in the championship and hasn't capitalised on opportunities here.

Albrighton - grafter and Puel clearly likes him, averages about 2 goals and 7 assists a season but can be one dimensional.

Diabate - barely played any games in the French second division, little end product.

 

Barnes - Confident, scores, assists, runs with the ball but perhaps not quite defensively strong enough yet.

 

 

 

Currently we're a defensively strong but uncreative side, makes sense to bring him back if we can.

 

 

 

[weller54]

54 minutes ago, Lambert09 said:

I think this should only happen if the manager thinks he is a better option than both Gray & Ghezzal. If not, then he really should stay out on loan. 

If he's not a better option than those two I'd be gobsmacked!.. 

Gray has been given enough chances and pitch time to prove himself.. He hasn't taken his opportunities and has made little or no progress. 

Ghezzal is..... to be kind,  just poor! 

Can't see why we're fannying around?.. Should have recalled him on 1st January,  could have played against Newport and he might just have got us through! 

[Nod.E]

5 hours ago, Captain... said:

Why would he be thrown in at the deep end next season? He will have a full preseason and friendlies to integrate into the squad and earn his place. There will be much less pressure on him at the start of next season, he can make a few sub appearances at the start and if he’s good enough he’ll soon be first choice. If not he can go on loan to a lower prem club in Jan.

 

You cut short his loan and deprive him of 20 odd games experience you are putting pressure on him to perform and Puel to play him, then there is the impact on players like Gray and Ghezzal who may find their chances further limited and if Barnes is struggling but still getting picked ahead of Gray then that will have a negative impact on the squad.

 

Obviously if Barnes comes back and tears it up, if he’s the missing piece in Puel’s plan and we go unbeaten to the end of the season then great. I just see a team lacking in stability and throwing in another variable could have a number of negative consequences .

You raise good points. I don't know anymore. Maybe p*ssing off Gray and Ghezzal will either see them leave or give them the kick up the arse they need. Anything to improve our current attacking force.

[Grebfromgrebland]

7 hours ago, Tom12345 said:

Yeah, what is happening with Leicester fans recently? It wasn’t too long ago we were in League One.

Not many can remember that far back. 

[Captain...]

5 hours ago, Ric Flair said:

You seem to be picturing the worst case scenario though for him. Maybe he comes back and performs like Choudhury has done. These kids are fearless, they arent riddled with the same mental scars that get carried along as baggage as players get older. I know you are raising some very good points but it simply comes down to the fact our alternatives right now are poor and I'm interested to see him get the rest of the season to bed in.

 

In terms of player development how you describe it above, is he going to progress more by playing another 20 games for West Brom and then starting as a bit part player next season, where he could easily fall out of favour and then go on loan again or if he comes back and makes 12+ starts in the PL, learns how to fit in to our system and feels integrated as a Premier League player for the rest of the season. Then after a full pre-season, he's one of the first names on the team sheet with half a seasons PL experience to refer to?

I am looking at the risks, it’s a big decision and it could set back his development. Barnes is doing very well at the moment and any decision that will impact his progress needs to be a considered one. That includes looking at the possible negative outcomes. Including the impact on the rest of the squad.

 

Of course it could be a success, but I just see so many other questions that we need to answer and at the moment Barnes is doing fantastic in the Championship so to recall needs to be with a purpose and a plan and not just desperation.

 

There other options to improve our current attacking options. Imagine we signed a good young talent on loan for the rest of the season and leave Barnes at West Brom. Tammy Abraham has just gone to Wolves, Hudson-Odoi seems to be available for the money we wasted on Slimani, someone like that young promising and realistically within our reach. We loan someone young and promising until the end of the season. If it works we can then potentially add this person and Barnes to our squad further increasing our options. 

 

Anyway lets wait on Claude, if he does get recalled how are you having us line up?