Coronavirus Thread

[Buce]

 

Seems strange to me that everyone is pointing the finger at schools and supermarkets, but nothing said about offices and factories still being open.

 

I would think 8 hours or so in an indoor confined space is more likely to pose a risk of infection than a brief encounter with the maskless in a shop, yet all essential retail is closed.

[Wasyls Pec Deck]

The more this crisis goes on it is becoming increasingly clear that the focus behind closed doors approach is the prioritize the economy over people’s lives. Yet of course the two are linked and it’s not a trade off. You need one for the other function. I think someone else has made this point in this thread, and it’s bang on. It’s such muddled thinking, then again when you look at who makes the decisions it’s not surprising is it! 

[Guest Fktf]

1 hour ago, Facecloth said:

Yes, but it difficult to challenge them at the door. Its about forcing them to change behaviour. A few times of walking round a shop and being refused service will soon get them on board.

I see what you're aiming for - it's a behavioral nudge. But I could see it meaning people wear no mask around the shop, and then quickly put it on in the last aisle before they head to the checkout. How would the checkout person know to refuse service, as far as they've seen this person is in a mask.

[Guest Fktf]

51 minutes ago, Pliskin said:

You’re dead right.... when you put the death toll into context and look at the population of this country, it is disastrous. And what @Faceclothsays is correct, the penalties for those deliberately braking the rules have been feeble, there’s even been people on social media with this “I do not consent” bollocks actually carrying on their businesses as normal, well they should have their relevant licences taken off them, sent to court and told they can never practice their trade again...... and hit with a massive fine and put it into the vaccine project....  sometimes things happen that are too big to just let the general public crack on with. 
 

My personal opinion is as usual we dragged our heels from the start and have since been chasing our tale, what should have been done as soon as this virus started going through Europe was all travel in and out of this country should have been stopped immediately but for import & export of products and dire emergencies. It would have been tough, but we still could have kept the economy ticking over, and we could have probably organised a more effective tier system, we probably wouldn’t have been able to avoid the virus from being here, but we could have kept the numbers lower than they are and potentially have spared many more lives. 
 

I know comparing us to New Zealand is wrong as they have many differences to us, but what you can compare is willingness to take action early, which they did. Our situation could have been better, a lot better had the government been proactive about the virus.... the moment this thing started to spread to other islands we should have seen the warning signs and acted. 

This thread in the weeks before the first lockdown makes an interesting read in relation to this.

[StanSP]

25 minutes ago, Buce said:

 

Seems strange to me that everyone is pointing the finger at schools and supermarkets, but nothing said about offices and factories still being open.

 

I would think 8 hours or so in an indoor confined space is more likely to pose a risk of infection than a brief encounter with the maskless in a shop, yet all essential retail is closed.

I didn't think offices were open, and if they were, it's the employers responsibility to ensure it's limited to a number which means it isn't cramped? Or open only to those who really can't work from home? 

[Pliskin]

4 minutes ago, StanSP said:

I didn't think offices were open, and if they were, it's the employers responsibility to ensure it's limited to a number which means it isn't cramped? Or open only to those who really can't work from home? 

They are, my office has been open since the first lockdown ended and hasn’t closed since.... there’s been anywhere up to 20 people in at anyone time. I’ve refused to go in so far. 

[Col city fan]

Just now, Pliskin said:

They are, my office has been open since the first lockdown ended and hasn’t closed since.... there’s been anywhere up to 20 people in at anyone time. I’ve refused to go in so far. 

THIS is the point for me

Of course offices are open. But when they shouldn’t be who is enforcing the closure? Other than the health minded owner?

[Col city fan]

13 minutes ago, Fktf said:

This thread in the weeks before the first lockdown makes an interesting read in relation to this.

In what way?

[SpacedX]

11 hours ago, Legend_in_blue said:

But during the early stages of the epidemic when staff in supermarkets were not wearing masks, the staff seemed unaffected.  

 

This was very early on - and there were stringent measures rapidly put into place regarding entry which you have alluded to.

.

11 hours ago, Legend_in_blue said:

Now we have masks, brought in far too late, and not needed during July/August during very low seasonal levels of transmission,

More people were outside during the summer - masks were still encouraged in buildings and indoor shared spaces although as you say, not immediately a mandatory requirement. And they weren't "very low levels of seasonal transmission" - as restrictions were relaxed the inevitable happened and by late August it was blindingly obvious that a second wave was imminent. 

 

11 hours ago, Legend_in_blue said:

Now where do we go in terms of relaxing mask measures? 

????? That's the last thing we need to be entertaining right now - it's completely the opposite.

 

11 hours ago, Legend_in_blue said:

Now where do we go in terms of relaxing mask measures?  Are masks not working now we see a surge in cases?  Or is it the minority not following rules causing it?  It's probably a bit of both.

Masks are merely a precautionary preventative measure not a panacea. However, a well fitted N95 respirator will not only significantly reduce the spread of exhaled aerosols but also the airborne contraction of the virus whilst filtering out other harmful particulates in an urban environment...try it.

 

11 hours ago, Legend_in_blue said:

In terms of masks, you have 4 groups of people imo.  1 - you must wear a mask and truly believe this makes a difference.  2 - you wear a mask to do your bit for society even if you don't agree with it, you go along with it as it's the right thing to do.  3 - you don't wear a mask for medical reasons.  4 - you don't wear a mask because you don't agree with them at all.

 

It would be interesting to know where people are with this. 

Actually, it would be interesting to know where you are with this.

 

Incidentally, you omitted the large category of informed people that wear a mask because scientifically, they understand that it makes a difference. Known science is not a question of 'belief' - how many ****ing times?

 

11 hours ago, Legend_in_blue said:

On a serious note, I dont think its possible to pin point anywhere or any one thing responsible for the rise in cases. 

Which is precisely why no virologist or epidemiologist does.

 

11 hours ago, Legend_in_blue said:

To blame it on people not following rules is too simplistic.  

No it isn't - although there are other variables, it's a major factor in the spread of the infection rate.

 

11 hours ago, Legend_in_blue said:

And, are these cases truly cases at all? 

No, they are all clearly fabricated and part of "their agenda" that you were rambling on about earlier in the week

 

11 hours ago, Legend_in_blue said:

I notice Yeadon on twitter is getting more irate as each day passes by.  Either he's nuts, or there's some truth in what he believes in.

That you are still squandering your time in pursuit of this nonsensical confirmation bias suggests to me that this is what you yourself want to believe in. 

 

Surely, surely, surely the absurd Talk Radio interview in which he was branded as an "expert in testing" and "labwork and the like" in which back in early December he hilariously claimed in his opinion that there was "strong evidence of Covid herd immunity in the UK" must have taught you something?

 

I wasn't going to bump this - but **** it, I will, because it typifies the opinionated populist crap spouted on this thread. As you yourself said - "You can't turn a blind eye to the raw data"  Odd then that some of you continue to do so.

 

https://www.foxestalk.co.uk/topic/122697-coronavirus-thread/?do=findComment&comment=5741846

 

Edited 31 December 2020 by Line-X

[Guest Harrydc]

COVID 19 may not be 'the big one'. We're not even through this, and they're already scaring us for the next one. Get ready for social distancing to continue.. Forever. 

 

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.inquirer.com/health/coronavirus/covid-19-coronavirus-who-world-health-organization-not-necessarily-big-one-20201229.html%3foutputType=amp

[StanSP]

Good. 

 

 

[Nalis]

6 minutes ago, Harrydc said:

COVID 19 may not be 'the big one'. We're not even through this, and they're already scaring us for the next one. Get ready for social distancing to continue.. Forever. 

 

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.inquirer.com/health/coronavirus/covid-19-coronavirus-who-world-health-organization-not-necessarily-big-one-20201229.html%3foutputType=amp

I think its completely plausible to say there could be worse pandemics out there in the future. They arent saying it will definitely happen soon or anything.

Edited 31 December 2020 by Nalis

[fox_favourite]

7 minutes ago, Harrydc said:

COVID 19 may not be 'the big one'. We're not even through this, and they're already scaring us for the next one. Get ready for social distancing to continue.. Forever. 

 

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.inquirer.com/health/coronavirus/covid-19-coronavirus-who-world-health-organization-not-necessarily-big-one-20201229.html%3foutputType=amp

I think that is easy to predict. Density of populations across the world and viruses aren't a good mix. But think of the time between this and the Spanish Flu. There have been scares in between as well. MERS SARS etc...it was always going to happen. Just the world was probably quietly ignoring the fact. 

 

This won't be the last one, but how far apart to the next is anyone's guess

[Carl the Llama]

6 minutes ago, Nalis said:

I think its completely plausible to say there could be worse pandemics out there in the future. They arent saying it will definitely happen soon or anything.

I think it's a certainty there'll be a worse one if we're going to approach any future pandemic how we've treated this one.  

[WigstonWanderer]

15 minutes ago, Carl the Llama said:

I think it's a certainty there'll be a worse one if we're going to approach any future pandemic how we've treated this one.  

It’s such a good job that this didn’t turn out to be the Spanish Flu.

[reynard]

1 hour ago, Buce said:

 

Seems strange to me that everyone is pointing the finger at schools and supermarkets, but nothing said about offices and factories still being open.

 

I would think 8 hours or so in an indoor confined space is more likely to pose a risk of infection than a brief encounter with the maskless in a shop, yet all essential retail is closed.

Retail is an easy target for closing though.

We operate offices and a distribution warehouse. The former have largely been closed since March 10th when my company took the decision that home working was to happen and all employees were set up with the facitilty to work from home. Offices in many cities lie empty. Last time I heard there were 25000 offices workers still working from home in Birmingham.

Our distribution centre set up social distance working measures from the start and though there have been a few covid cases recently until December there were none at all. They have not closed at all.

With the new varient you could argue, I think, that only a total lockdown akin to that in Italy had in April/May, will be enough to get numbers down a lot. I think the truth is that there is a risk in any confined environment and maybe now even outside if the new varient is as infectious as stated.

The thing about work places is that they should at least be practising best practice. Schools too though I can't see why masks are not compulsory all the time.

Probably about time masks were made compulsory even outside too.

[BenTheFox]

1 hour ago, Buce said:

 

Seems strange to me that everyone is pointing the finger at schools and supermarkets, but nothing said about offices and factories still being open.

 

I would think 8 hours or so in an indoor confined space is more likely to pose a risk of infection than a brief encounter with the maskless in a shop, yet all essential retail is closed.

The issue with factories is that even those that are not directly supplying supermarkets may be supplying those that do. Also, if online shopping services remain open then goods need to be manufactured. Would open a real can of worms. 

[Nalis]

24 minutes ago, Carl the Llama said:

I think it's a certainty there'll be a worse one if we're going to approach any future pandemic how we've treated this one.  

I wasnt commenting on that variable though bit yeaj, fair point.

[Buce]

1 minute ago, BenTheFox said:

The issue with factories is that even those that are not directly supplying supermarkets may be supplying those that do. Also, if online shopping services remain open then goods need to be manufactured. Would open a real can of worms. 

 

Were they not shut during the National Lockdown?

 

And, seriously, essential manufacturing excluded, who actually needs the shit BooHoo and the likes provide? Walk around a pound shop: every shitty plastic toy/ornament has a factory somewhere that's producing it.

[whoareyaaa]

36 minutes ago, Carl the Llama said:

I think it's a certainty there'll be a worse one if we're going to approach any future pandemic how we've treated this one.  

This is the first pandemic of this type for what 100 years? its a rare occurrence.. why should we expect another one so soon and if we have another one anytime soon then there is other hands at play here.

 

Is it not a bit of coincidence that as soon as we have a vaccine for the first virus another virus has appeared out of nowhere. strange.

 

 

 

 

[BenTheFox]

11 minutes ago, Buce said:

 

Were they not shut during the National Lockdown?

 

And, seriously, essential manufacturing excluded, who actually needs the shit BooHoo and the likes provide? Walk around a pound shop: every shitty plastic toy/ornament has a factory somewhere that's producing it.

Many factories remained open during the national lockdown. 

[Apollo]

14 minutes ago, BenTheFox said:

Many factories remained open during the national lockdown. 

We supply the factories with essential parts - the car factories etc shut their doors, but most in our area were unaffected. This means the entire supply chain stays open as well, so for me and my colleagues, from a working point of view this year has been no different to any other. Been in the branch as normal all through the year!

[BenTheFox]

4 minutes ago, Apollo said:

We supply the factories with essential parts - the car factories etc shut their doors, but most in our area were unaffected. This means the entire supply chain stays open as well, so for me and my colleagues, from a working point of view this year has been no different to any other. Been in the branch as normal all through the year!

That's it! I know someone who works in a factory where they manufacture packaging for pharmaceutical and cosmetic products, amongst other things. Seeing as these products are still being sold in pharmacies and supermarkets, they are required to stay open and therefore the factories that supply them with materials also must continue to run and so on. 

[UniFox21]

1 hour ago, Harrydc said:

COVID 19 may not be 'the big one'. We're not even through this, and they're already scaring us for the next one. Get ready for social distancing to continue.. Forever. 

 

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.inquirer.com/health/coronavirus/covid-19-coronavirus-who-world-health-organization-not-necessarily-big-one-20201229.html%3foutputType=amp

They've been predicting big zoonotic infections for decades. It's regularly reported and studied how the open food markets and way the bird trade in East Asia is managed will regularly lead to increased risk. 

 

This isn't big news at all.

[Leicester_Loyal]

I know someone who works in a factory producing whiskey, they have been open since the first lockdown as normal. Anything in manufacturing was pretty much allowed to stay open.

 

In other news, I wouldn't bank on being back to normal by Easter.

 

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-9098459/Matt-Hancock-reveals-Britain-530-000-doses-Oxfords-Covid-jab-week.html