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Wymsey

US Presidential Election 2020

By Wymsey, in General Chat

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leicsmac

leicsmac

Posted
Posted
1 minute ago, Dahnsouff said:

Reading through this thread is interesting, but this bit in bold stuck out - it sounds quite arrogant too me, and I apologise in advance if I have misunderstood!

That's quite alright - allow me to clarify.

 

People who voted for Trump having been duped by false promises by him has been floated as a possible mitigating factor in both their own actions since and the actions of the administration itself (though not by me, I think most people went to the polls with eyes wide open, if not in 2016 then certainly in 2020).

 

I was curious as to how much the people who were "taken in" (if one believes that) are actually responsible for the way things have played out.

 

 

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Dahnsouff

Dahnsouff

Posted
Posted
1 minute ago, leicsmac said:

That's quite alright - allow me to clarify.

 

People who voted for Trump having been duped by false promises by him has been floated as a possible mitigating factor in both their own actions since and the actions of the administration itself (though not by me, I think most people went to the polls with eyes wide open, if not in 2016 then certainly in 2020).

 

I was curious as to how much the people who were "taken in" (if one believes that) are actually responsible for the way things have played out.

You were too quick, I edited my original post for risk of falling foul of my own accusation! Too late!

 

I do not find it that surprising that so many people voted for Trump (nor too many degrees of separation as elsewhere in the global political landscape). He represented both a haven for non mainstream views and a point of action for every perceived injustice he tweeted about that day. That and the fact he is also a (laughable fake) capitalist, something America prides itself on.

 

In one sense, it was a case of right place, right time, right guy - unfortunately

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Guest SO1

Guest SO1

Posted
Posted

When they start the evictions and foreclosures(now), regardless of what the Federal Government does, is when the real violence will happen.

 

There are many landlords, owners of rental properties and banks etc. who owe money to other banks and financial institutions. Like dominoes falling with the Populace taking the biggest hit at the bottom of the pile. As in homelessness off the charts. Everything is at stake now and has been building for many years with banks and financial institutions always getting bailed out but the citizens receive no or little help. And the Grift continues to the next financial blow up.

 

I expect the violence that occurs will be mostly on a local level as that is where the rubber meets the road so to speak. Trump has little to do with whats coming and will surely be scapegoated by the media. This is about government screwing over the working person. For decades.

 

This is like the Perfect Storm and I'm scared sxxtless about the state of this country. The Government talks about sending us 2000 checks. Not going to help much if your months behind on your rent or mortgage and you have to feed a family without work and of course you still owe taxes. I'm OK. But there are many others who are not.

Please don't talk to me about Trump anymore. Its just a waste of time. This is about solving real problems for real people. Now. And we have to do it because the government isn't and won't.

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Buce

Buce

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1 minute ago, Jon the Hat said:

It's diplomacy, you don't slag off the leader of your ally even if he is a massive knobhead.

 

Nonsense.

 

Trump is no longer the 'leader of our ally' in any meaningful sense; and surely the better diplomacy would have been to curry favour with Biden by telling it as it is, as many national leaders have. His refusal to directly implicate Trump in last night's events is a disgrace, and something which won't have gone unnoticed by the incoming administration.

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hackneyfox

hackneyfox

Posted
Posted
13 minutes ago, Jon the Hat said:

It's diplomacy, you don't slag off the leader of your ally even if he is a massive knobhead.

Really? He was happy enough to say this about him before Trump tool power:

Referring to Trump’s subsequent claim that his ban was justified because immigrants had made parts of London “no go zones” for non-Muslims, including police officers, Johnson went on to say that Trump was “betraying a quite stupefying ignorance that makes him frankly unfit to hold the office of president of the United States.”

“I would invite him to come and see the whole of London and take him round the city,” Johnson added, “except that I wouldn’t want to expose Londoners to any unnecessary risk of meeting Donald Trump.”

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Dunge

Dunge

Posted
Posted
50 minutes ago, Jon the Hat said:

It's diplomacy, you don't slag off the leader of your ally even if he is a massive knobhead.

In general, yeah... but it’s probably time he did now. Trump’s outgoing and the events of last night were pretty unequivocal. At the very least, the guy has invited a riot against the seat of American democracy.

I kind of want Johnson to join Sturgeon in saying that he won’t be welcome in the UK.

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Mickyblueeyes

Mickyblueeyes

Posted
Posted

One police officer is still in hospital after being beaten during riots - Washington police chief


And apparently the officer who shot dead the individual, has been placed on administrative leave. I think it is just standard procedure. However, I hope he or she is not punished for simply doing their job of protecting people.

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Mickyblueeyes

Mickyblueeyes

Posted
Posted
1 hour ago, Jon the Hat said:

It's diplomacy, you don't slag off the leader of your ally even if he is a massive knobhead.

The prime minister has criticised the outgoing US president for "encouraging people to storm the Capitol" and casting doubt on the result of last year's election.

Mr Johnson was speaking in response to a question from a journalist at the Downing Street coronavirus briefing on Thursday.

He said: "All my life America has stood for some very important things - an idea of freedom and an idea of democracy.

"As you suggest, in so far as he (President Trump) encouraged people to storm the Capitol and in so far as the president has consistently cast doubt on the outcome of a free and fair election, I believe that that was completely wrong.

"What President Trump has been saying about that is completely wrong and I unreservedly condemn encouraging people to behave in the disgraceful way that they did in the Capitol.

"All I can say is that I'm very pleased that the president-elect has now been duly confirmed in office and that democracy has prevailed."

 

Better approach this time. Well done PM, it’s the right thing to do. I genuinely believe a lot of our politicians were quite shocked at what happen which is why they’ve changed approach as the day has gone on. This isn’t a fault, what happen was madness. 

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HighPeakFox

HighPeakFox

Posted
Posted

Not going to get into personal politics, but I would say that there is a strong case to say that USA has used the rules of covert warfare on itself before - and were able to get away with, essentially, a military coup by murdering their own president, because he threatened to take federal power back into government. Every wannabe Fash (and plenty of others, it must be said) did not shed a tear for the demise of JFK, who, flawed though he was, was setting a different course in trying to splinter the CIA into tiny pieces and bring the currency in-house again.

 

There's much I despise about the USA, but every president that gets voted in already knows, or quickly discovers, just how much their hands are tied to the massive corporates and their game of corrupt bribery (lobbying), and it always makes me laugh when the President is described as 'the most powerful man in the world', because it just isn't true. It's a fallacy we want to believe because then we think the system still works. 

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SpacedX

SpacedX

Posted
Posted (edited)
5 hours ago, Voll Blau said:

She condemned the violence and said Trump should condemn the violence that had taken place.

She was then pushed on his complicity and invited to explicity condemn his involvement, and all she could muster was that he'd done "very little to de-escalate the situation".

How hard is it to condemn him - not "violence", not the crowd at large, not "words of provocation" - him.

 

5 hours ago, Mickyblueeyes said:

I’ve watched the Sky interview four times now because twice it’s been raised that she condemned him. For me, in that interview, she didn’t. I’m sorry, it’s not very hard and she’s shown that by doing it very well in the BBC one after. She condemned the actions of the individuals but not Trump for his role.  Is Donald Trump inciting this, well yes - it’s quite simple. I can appreciate it was probably early morning and she didn’t have the press brief as yet but that doesn’t excuse it.

Agree - her objections should have been forthcoming, explicit and if anything vehement. However, as I said, the self righteous sanctimony of subjective social media outrage and at times double standards associated with this faux outrage on behalf of those posting and those that leap on to it always amuses me. And on that subject, that Emily Thornberry tweet is hilarious coming from a member of a political party whose then leadership refused to condemn Russia for the Skripal poisoning on British soil. 

Edited by Line-X
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