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urban.spaceman

Man City Post Match Thread - first defeat in 12

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6 minutes ago, Danny Clender said:

It's an interesting theory and perfectly plausible, but I personally doubt it. 

Seems quite an unusual time to agree to it and I just can't see Rodgers being that casual.

 

I agree with your thoughts on his ability not to react.

 

What would the solutions have been?

 

Choudhury on for Perez, extra block in midfield?

Morgan on to bolster defence, but not many are happy with that?

Justin on to push Ricardo further up?

Nacho on as we've previously found success in?

 

sets up next Thursday sweetly. 

 

 

Brendan is now the third highest paid manger in this country ....

 he should be able to come up with a tactics tweak to stop what was happening during that first half ........ it was frustrating for us to watch and think that nothing was changing ....a bit like the old adage that ‘only an idiot does the same thing over and over again expecting a different outcome’ .  last weekend he made a first half sub because if wasn’t working ....... he didn’t wait for half time.  He could have moved personnel around drawing YT closer to wilf so that they could cover across as a two more effectively. Then when mahrez comes inside, he arrives at a challenge before he can shoot. There are lots of things he could have done but nothing seemed to be the choice and I just don’t buy that based on what I’ve seen of Rodgers so far..  the absence of hamza from the bench one of the more curious decisions of the day ........ almost like ‘we’re playing this way and by not having HC on the bench we can’t change to the more traditional way of playing a low block at Man City’ ...... very odd 

 

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2 minutes ago, st albans fox said:

Brendan is now the third highest paid manger in this country ....

 he should be able to come up with a tactics tweak to stop what was happening during that first half ........ it was frustrating for us to watch and think that nothing was changing ....a bit like the old adage that ‘only an idiot does the same thing over and over again expecting a different outcome’ .  last weekend he made a first half sub because if wasn’t working ....... he didn’t wait for half time.  He could have moved personnel around drawing YT closer to wilf so that they could cover across as a two more effectively. Then when mahrez comes inside, he arrives at a challenge before he can shoot. There are lots of things he could have done but nothing seemed to be the choice and I just don’t buy that based on what I’ve seen of Rodgers so far..  the absence of hamza from the bench one of the more curious decisions of the day ........ almost like ‘we’re playing this way and by not having HC on the bench we can’t change to the more traditional way of playing a low block at Man City’ ...... very odd 

 

Oh yes, my first option of HC coming on for Perez would have been illegal as he was not in the squad. 

He should have been there for this game. 

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I was thinking during the game if we had someone like Fuchs available to shore up that left back slot it could’ve left Chilwell to man mark Riyad out the game + we know how good Chilwell is at breaking and Riyad not so much at tracking. 
 

They came at us so many times on that left side & it was like historically where Danny Simpson had to defend on his own when Riyad was with us - as Barnes was trying to support Vardy. 
 

KDB - just too good though. 

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One of Brendan's criticisms at Celtic was that he went toe to toe with anyone with his beliefs and style. This saw them getting hammered at PSG where everyone could predict the car crash about to happen and then had to sit through it with Brendan at the wheel completely oblivious to it all. 

 

I know Puel wasn't everyone's cup of tea and I'm not for one moment saying he's anywhere near as all round good as Brendan but Puel did seem to set up well against the big teams but really struggled against the lesser teams at home, which Brendan seems to have mastered. 

 

My one question (not criticism of Brendan) is will he learn from yesterday? 

 

 

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6 minutes ago, Collymore said:

One of Brendan's criticisms at Celtic was that he went toe to toe with anyone with his beliefs and style. This saw them getting hammered at PSG where everyone could predict the car crash about to happen and then had to sit through it with Brendan at the wheel completely oblivious to it all. 

 

I know Puel wasn't everyone's cup of tea and I'm not for one moment saying he's anywhere near as all round good as Brendan but Puel did seem to set up well against the big teams but really struggled against the lesser teams at home, which Brendan seems to have mastered. 

 

My one question (not criticism of Brendan) is will he learn from yesterday? 

 

 

We hardly went toe to toe at OT ???  That was the criticism at the time .....

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8 minutes ago, ForeverandEver said:

I was thinking during the game if we had someone like Fuchs available to shore up that left back slot it could’ve left Chilwell to man mark Riyad out the game + we know how good Chilwell is at breaking and Riyad not so much at tracking. 
 

They came at us so many times on that left side & it was like historically where Danny Simpson had to defend on his own when Riyad was with us - as Barnes was trying to support Vardy. 
 

KDB - just too good though. 

Fuchs would have been more effective at marking Riyhad than Chilly.  Agree, could have played Fuchs left back and Chilly off the left midfield yesterday.  Easy in hindsight though isn't it!  KDB is just on another level, finding little pockets all over the pitch.  We tried to impose our newly developed possession game on the team who are masters at possession and we got a serious lesson.

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Surely after the third or fourth time the ball landed at Mahrez' feet and him cutting inside, getting past Chilwell with ease, was the moment to change tactics and deploy a second LCFC player to make his life more difficult?

 

We left them so much space on both flanks, it was embarrassing to see no reaction to it. And our midfield hardly ever had an answer to control the ball and initiate attacks, either because they let the pressure get to them or because Rodgers had no plan how to change it effectively.

We were punished for our passiveness, and deservedly so. Only aspect that makes this defeat less tragic is the fact that Manchester City have a superior side, a De Bruyne at the top of his game and plenty of options on the bench. They are also years ahead in terms of implementing and executing Guardiola's tactics, whereas we are in Year One under Rodgers.

 

Still second, but we can and need to do better again.

I want to see much more determination, precision and sharpness against Liverpool.

Edited by MC Prussian
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I only assume BR thought we could match them but no chance plain as day  after first 10 minutes and no changes not even the shape of what we had on the pitch.After Vardy somehow gave us the lead I was literally thinking gets defensive subs on(even though we didn't have any) and try to hang on for 1-0 or 1-1.

Not a great feeling to be outthought and outplayed.

I remember cup game  I think  last year might have been the Christmas league fixture against these and Fuchs did a job on Mahrez mainly because he stayed very close to him its the only way to play the guy and Chilly bless isn't that good and had little help.

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I ama amazed coaches dont play two full backs when playing top teams pressing them like City did yesterday. 

 

Fuchs with Chilwell in front or Fuchs in a back five would have allowed Chilwell to get up the pitch being naturally left footed.

 

Playing a midfield three with Maddison further forward  up alongside Vardy like at chelsea would have offered more security to the overloads city have.

 

Not saying this would have prevented a defeat but it might have made it more compeititve.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

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Only really Schmeichel, Vardy and Evans can take positives out of that- all played well to varying degrees, Vardy had few moments but in each of them was a threat, beat defenders twice before nearly scoring and just evading Barnes, another great cross that Barnes should've done better with and a superb goal. He really is a top striker in outstanding form. Schmeichel made some good saves and Evans was more solid out of the two centre-backs. 

 

Apart from that, we gave them too much space, Chilwell and Ndidi almost doing the jobs of two players. Maddison, Tielemans, Perez, Barnes all didn't offer enough, even Soyuncu wasn't as solid as usual. You can't afford that many not affecting the game at a place like that.

 

I think we'll learn from it, it wasn't a lack of ambition that cost us, and we don't have a "top six" away match until Arsenal now in April so most of those are out of the way, but maybe we need to adapt for these games, be a bit more pragmatic (though I know Rodgers was heavily criticised for it at Man United) and set up in a more compact way.

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We seemed nervous on the big stage for such an important game. Technically, tactically they were in a different league and completely destroyed our normal game. They had more intensity, we had no time to pass accurately they were one us every time and our normal structured game plan did not work. Unfortunately BR did not have an answer and I don't think we had one corner which demonstrates  our attacking wing backs were stifled.

The penalty awarded was typical case of diving and it saddens me that this cheating part of the game must be practiced behind closed doors at many clubs.

The only positive outcome from the match demonstrated that several of our key players are not yet ready for the big transfer moves touted by the media and I think the same would now apply to BR as well. 

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44 minutes ago, PaddyS said:

Should have brought Hamza on after 15mins to sit with Wilf, It would have helped Chilwell too.

Was amazed we didn't change things at half time.

Lucky to get away with 3-1 I think.

And you'd of done a better job managing the team yesterday then, I suppose?

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45 minutes ago, PaddyS said:

Should have brought Hamza on after 15mins to sit with Wilf, It would have helped Chilwell too.

Was amazed we didn't change things at half time.

Lucky to get away with 3-1 I think.

Hamza wasn't even on the bench. But agree had he been available this was one of the very few occasions where it would have been acceptable to play two DMs.

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Just now, Adster said:

The amount of football experts armed with hindsight in this thread is unreal, isn't it? 

 

We were beaten by a better team today, just deal with it. We go again on Boxing day.

No one had a huge problem pre game as we relished the chance to go toe to toe and see how it went.  The problem people have is the non reaction to it plainly not working .......

 

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A reality check and not before time for some and yes, I am thinking of you Strings and Pipes. The gulf between Man C and Liverpool and the rest is still massive, but being best of the rest would see this be a fantastic season.

 

Our FBs have had a lot of praise, rightly, this season but it's their attacking play that's special, not their defensive work. Both were made to look pretty ordinary yesterday, though neither had any help from the wide player supposedly in front of them. Both have plenty of time to grow, and long term this chasing won't have done them any harm.

 

Both CBS were as good as they could be against wave after wave of attack, their problem being that, as BR said, our midfield 4 didn't show for them and Man C's superb high press meant possession surrendered time after time.

 

Only a couple of weeks ago Sounessaurus said Ndidi-Tielemans-Maddison was as good a three as any in the league. Well they weren't yesterday, not remotely as good as KDB, Silva and Gundogan. KDB showed us what world class looks like. Tielemans showed us what 22 year old Belgian squad players look like when against world class opposition. At least Madders showed and looked for forward passes, but with nothing wide it was Vardy or backwards for him. 

 

As for Barnes and Perez. Well. I'm sure I'm not the only one who now has an atavistic reaction to them being selected. I was briefly hopeful that Barnes's pace might hurt Man C when the team was announced, but after 10 mins I'd given up on him and Perez (nice assist though). We all know Barnes is going to be great, just not any time soon. And Perez has only looked a £30M player at Southampton and for the odd 30 mins here and there. Both need taking out of the fray, as they are getting worse each game.

 

And that's the  difference for me - the quality of our wide players. The other nine selected yesterday would all get regular game time at one or more of the so-called Big Six clubs. None of our quartet of wide players would, and I'm not sure they'd be regulars at any of the mid-table clubs either. This isn't news, I know, and I'm sure BR wanted another wide player in the summer (and expected more from Perez than he's getting). If we are to consolidate a top four position rather than fade away to the horrors of the Europa League in the second half of the season, we must, must sign a quality, goal-scoring wide player.  

 

Oh, and Choudhury starts on Boxing Day, or it'll be the same again. It might be anyway!

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4 minutes ago, Farrington fox said:

Having seen some more footage of the game. Jeez, Mahrez absolutely owned Chilly. Wtf,Chilwell barely got a challenge in all game. 

He was left unprotected, but I was a little surprised he got rinsed so easily by Mahrez on a few occasions considering he must've seen all of Mahrez's tricks a thousand times in training.

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We were beaten by the better team on the day.  MC are coming back into form, we're on the downward end of an amazing run, which wasn't going to last for the rest of the season.

 

I'm still completely puzzled by the lack of outrage at the assault on Harvey Barnes, and no penalty, which would have made it 2-2 had Vardy scored.

Imagine if Kasper had cleared out KdB like that - the ref would have been surrounded by MC players, Guardiola would have forced the 4th assistant to get Dean to refer it to VAR and a penalty would have been awarded.

I think Rodgers needs to be a little more Klopp-like as well. Remember when Salah was injured by a Choudhury challenge and Klopp made some fairly unpleasant post-match comments about players deliberately hurting his darlings.  BR should have highlighted that we had a player injured and had to go off in a challenge that should have been a penalty. 

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8 minutes ago, Mythyaar said:

Hamza wasn't even on the bench. But agree had he been available this was one of the very few occasions where it would have been acceptable to play two DMs.

Ha! That's a good reason why he didn't come on then!

 

In my defence, I was watching on TV with a bunch of drunk people so we weren't listening to commentary or noticing much at all really, including who the subs were.

But it was clear we had to change something.

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