Harvey Barnes

[Nicolo Barella]

7 hours ago, jeffschlupp said:

I like Barnes, and as a Leicestershire lad I am desperate for him to do well as we all are.

 

His downfall is for me the complete opposite of Gray - whereas Demarai struggles with making the right decision, Barnes doesn't get himself in the right positions half the time to make up for his lack of finesse for his young age.

 

Every time we get the ball down the left Barnes is stood between the centre back and the full back like a 'left striker' rather than a winger. When he does drop deep it never goes anywhere. Watch Perez on the other side make runs, drift inside, drop deep, push to the byline etc. - it's a different world.

 

If you sit so far up the pitch waiting for the ball to come to you, first it ain't gonna get there, and second you completely stunt the main asset of your full-back in mazy runs on the overlap, because he's got no one inside to play the one-two with.

 

All we end up with is Maddison trying to compensate for that, getting dragged wide rather than being the extra man in the centre, and then attacks break down when Wilf has to push up into the space.

I don't know, I've noticed that he very often manages to get right in front of goal at nearly the right time - against Villa he got into two or three positions where he nearly poached a goal or two, same as vs Watford where Masina made the clearance of his life. That said, it isn't consistent movement I agree, he doesn't seem to know where exactly to kick-start his runs to from the wing. If you combined Perez's movement with the rest of Barnes' game you'd have the greatest winger in the PL that couldn't finish! 

 

I do think it's coming for Barnes. He's still learning how to play on the wing, after playing centrally most of his young career. I'd love to see him as the 10 in some cup games.

[whoareyaaa]

1 hour ago, Nicolo Barella said:

I don't know, I've noticed that he very often manages to get right in front of goal at nearly the right time - against Villa he got into two or three positions where he nearly poached a goal or two, same as vs Watford where Masina made the clearance of his life. That said, it isn't consistent movement I agree, he doesn't seem to know where exactly to kick-start his runs to from the wing. If you combined Perez's movement with the rest of Barnes' game you'd have the greatest winger in the PL that couldn't finish! 

 

I do think it's coming for Barnes. He's still learning how to play on the wing, after playing centrally most of his young career. I'd love to see him as the 10 in some cup games.

I tend to agree further up field he does seem to get into the right position all we have to do is look at how many chances he has missed, I think his composure in front of goal is the problem he seems to rush everything... 

 

His defensive side of the game is not that great but I'm not expecting it to be either 

[Nicolo Barella]

9 minutes ago, whoareyaaa said:

I tend to agree further up field he does seem to get into the right position all we have to do is look at how many chances he has missed, I think his composure in front of goal is the problem he seems to rush everything... 

 

His defensive side of the game is not that great but I'm not expecting it to be either 

In fairness his workrate is good enough, so maybe his defensive positioning will come with time.

[Chrysalis]

On 17/12/2019 at 09:07, Shmokeee said:

Mahrez may well of impressed you first time you saw him but go back and look at his form and figures from his first 16 games with us. And as you correctly point out, that was in the championship( a far lower standard and a way, way easier league to make your mark as a player)

Then go look at Harvey’s first 16 in the championship.

Vardy was wrote off by a lot of people playing at a lower standard. But with time, guidance and confidence building, we have the current prem top scorer.

 

2 seasons ago, how many people saying chillwell wasn’t good enough?

 

Simple fact is there is no magical formula to make a player achieve his potential, it comes with dedication and patience, both in abundance.

 

I genuinely believe Barnes can go on to be our most successful academy graduate. Ever.

 

 

I think you treating each position as equal to one another.

 

If a midfielder doesnt do his job properly, it can be worked around by the team, but things like shots at goal can make and break a team's success.  Often the difference between a top team and a lower placed team is just that the top team is ruthless on their shot conversion rate.  Remember when we down with akinbiyi as striker? for much of that season we actually played well but just suffered from horrible shot conversion rate due to the striker.

 

Long term Barnes may be an absolute gem of a player, who knows, I think he is good, but I dont consider him at the level of someone like Mahrez.  When I first seen Mahrez, it was immediately obvious of his quality, and  the fact he is now a Pep player is no surprise at all, It was visible from the first time I seen him with the ball.  Now did Mahrez have a crap ton of shots at goal with a success rate in low single digits? I cannot remember.  I do think short term needs mean something, and shouldnt be brushed aside for what is potentially good long term.  I have no issue with Barnes taking pot shots when we 4-0 up, but if its 0-0 or only one goal in it I expect him to use his brain and pass to someone who can shoot, thats all really, there is nothing complicated about that.  It can be done as Gray has clearly been told to stop shooting every time he has the ball and he is now a better player for it.

[Ric Flair]

20 hours ago, Stadt said:

@Ric Flairalways brings up that he’s looked more dangerous on the right, it should probably be tried out more often

I also think the issues he currently has with not knowing where to position himself wouldn't be as important. Ricardo is next level in running the whole flank by himself, where as Chilwell can't be having Barnes playing up out there at times. Plus he seems look more at ease on the right, highly doubtful Rodgers will do it though.

[Ric Flair]

5 hours ago, whoareyaaa said:

I tend to agree further up field he does seem to get into the right position all we have to do is look at how many chances he has missed, I think his composure in front of goal is the problem he seems to rush everything... 

 

His defensive side of the game is not that great but I'm not expecting it to be either 

The amount of chances he has had is an art form in itself, none of our other wingers get in to those sorts of spaces. That's why I'm confident he has the minerals to be unreal at this level, he has scored regularly at every level below the Prem but we just somehow need to get the belief and tangible results in to him and the goals will flow.

[Mark]

18 minutes ago, Ric Flair said:

I also think the issues he currently has with not knowing where to position himself wouldn't be as important. Ricardo is next level in running the whole flank by himself, where as Chilwell can't be having Barnes playing up out there at times. Plus he seems look more at ease on the right, highly doubtful Rodgers will do it though.

I don't think he's more comfortable there, I know his two goals have come over that side but they've been first time shots from what I recall. I'm not sure he'll cut inside onto his left as comfortably, just like Albrighton can't cut onto his left when he's played on the right compared to when he cuts inside successfully on the left. At West Brom he was the main man they looked to create, he was rarely subbed off as they knew he'd do something in the end and he often did. He's not got that responsibility or confidence to do that here.

[Steve_Guppy_Left_Foot]

Really hope he plays absolute blinders against man city and Liverpool to stop all this utter drivel being spouted.

[oxford blue]

I'm surprised at the criticism  he has been receiving. He has shown he has the talent to be worthy of a start; I think that when he scores more frequently, his whole play will improve. Confidence in any sport is huge. Against Watford he was in most eyes the man of the match. He's young, it's it's first full season on PL; having an off day is not unexpected. I'm confident Rodgers will provide the support he needs to become a quality playerrer

[Ric Flair]

33 minutes ago, Mark said:

I don't think he's more comfortable there, I know his two goals have come over that side but they've been first time shots from what I recall. I'm not sure he'll cut inside onto his left as comfortably, just like Albrighton can't cut onto his left when he's played on the right compared to when he cuts inside successfully on the left. At West Brom he was the main man they looked to create, he was rarely subbed off as they knew he'd do something in the end and he often did. He's not got that responsibility or confidence to do that here.

Maybe so, I just don't think cutting in and shooting has produced much success and he seems to find pockets of space more on the right where he could then keep composure. All speculative on my part though.

[Gerard]

4 hours ago, Chrysalis said:

 

I think you treating each position as equal to one another.

 

If a midfielder doesnt do his job properly, it can be worked around by the team, but things like shots at goal can make and break a team's success.  Often the difference between a top team and a lower placed team is just that the top team is ruthless on their shot conversion rate.  Remember when we down with akinbiyi as striker? for much of that season we actually played well but just suffered from horrible shot conversion rate due to the striker.

 

Long term Barnes may be an absolute gem of a player, who knows, I think he is good, but I dont consider him at the level of someone like Mahrez.  When I first seen Mahrez, it was immediately obvious of his quality, and  the fact he is now a Pep player is no surprise at all, It was visible from the first time I seen him with the ball.  Now did Mahrez have a crap ton of shots at goal with a success rate in low single digits? I cannot remember.  I do think short term needs mean something, and shouldnt be brushed aside for what is potentially good long term.  I have no issue with Barnes taking pot shots when we 4-0 up, but if its 0-0 or only one goal in it I expect him to use his brain and pass to someone who can shoot, thats all really, there is nothing complicated about that.  It can be done as Gray has clearly been told to stop shooting every time he has the ball and he is now a better player for it.

 

What was Mahrez doing at the same age in the 2011/12 season?

 

Played 9 scored 0 for Le Havre in Ligue 2. 

 

Barnes is quality and has assisted more than anyone in this team and is finding his feet in his first year of PL football, I'm not sure what people expect from our player to be honest. 

[ScouseFox]

convinced he's going to do some absolutely mad things tonight 

[Ric Flair]

31 minutes ago, ScouseFox said:

convinced he's going to do some absolutely mad things tonight 

He has tended to play much better after the fans start chuntering and this weeks waffle has been unpresecendted so brace incoming. 

[dmayne7]

Read this thread and compare it to the Perez one. Got some weird fans who'd rather give a £30m signing time than a kid from the youth team. 2 players whilst different in the skillset and individual contribution, are having a similar effect on the overall performance of the team.

[Tanya]

I'm always in favour of giving Barnes time. He is so young and he gets into great positions so he is an intelligent lad. Wish he got onto the pitch tonight 

[jayfox26]

42 minutes ago, dmayne7 said:

Read this thread and compare it to the Perez one. Got some weird fans who'd rather give a £30m signing time than a kid from the youth team. 2 players whilst different in the skillset and individual contribution, are having a similar effect on the overall performance of the team.

Both of them are similar in that they can really impact games but both are really poor with end product, especially when it comes to finishing. They've both been guilty if missing huge chances this season. If they both get the composure in front of goal, we have 2 very good players on our hands. I'm sure Brendan will bring the best out of them both  

[volpeazzurro]

Think he's far more likely to cause Man City's defence more problems at the weekend running at them than Perez.

[eblair]

this thread is bizarre, he has shown bits of quality and if he had a bit more composure he had 5 goals this season to add to the fact he has most assists in our team this year

 

vardy scored 5 his first season in the prem, everyone slagging a leicester kid off needs to have a look in the mirror

[adam95581]

On 18/12/2019 at 01:37, jeffschlupp said:

I like Barnes, and as a Leicestershire lad I am desperate for him to do well as we all are.

 

His downfall is for me the complete opposite of Gray - whereas Demarai struggles with making the right decision, Barnes doesn't get himself in the right positions half the time to make up for his lack of finesse for his young age.

 

Every time we get the ball down the left Barnes is stood between the centre back and the full back like a 'left striker' rather than a winger. When he does drop deep it never goes anywhere. Watch Perez on the other side make runs, drift inside, drop deep, push to the byline etc. - it's a different world.

 

If you sit so far up the pitch waiting for the ball to come to you, first it ain't gonna get there, and second you completely stunt the main asset of your full-back in mazy runs on the overlap, because he's got no one inside to play the one-two with.

 

All we end up with is Maddison trying to compensate for that, getting dragged wide rather than being the extra man in the centre, and then attacks break down when Wilf has to push up into the space.

This is the Pérez who has been playing in top leagues for 5 or 6 years. Compared to Barnes who is in his first full season. What’s the difference...🤔

[jeffschlupp]

4 hours ago, adam95581 said:

This is the Pérez who has been playing in top leagues for 5 or 6 years. Compared to Barnes who is in his first full season. What’s the difference...🤔

Where in that post did I comment on the reasons for his bad positioning? I'm simply stating what his biggest problem is, in my opinion...

[adam95581]

In fairness, that comment wasn’t really directed at you. It’s more directed at those who’d like to sack him off despite how young he is and now much potential he’s shown. Your points were fair. 

[RobHawk]

There's alot of drivel in here. First full season in the prem and he's helped propel the team into 2nd place at Christmas.

 

I'd be worried if there wasn't room for improvement. But the boy is special, so dangerous on the ball and his finishing will improve. He's a huge player for us who's only gonna get better. Get behind the lad, he'll be another England international soon.

[aussie-fox]

4 hours ago, RobHawk said:

There's alot of drivel in here. First full season in the prem and he's helped propel the team into 2nd place at Christmas.

 

I'd be worried if there wasn't room for improvement. But the boy is special, so dangerous on the ball and his finishing will improve. He's a huge player for us who's only gonna get better. Get behind the lad, he'll be another England international soon.

I fully believe that had he put away the majority of his chances last season and this season he'd be very close or if not already in the England team.

[Leicester_Loyal]

We do need a world class winger but there's no way the lad should be binned off. Some of you are mad! It'll be Albrighton who makes way for the new signing.

[eblair]

Come on Harvey - You lot are gonna be so fickle

Edited 21 December 2019 by eblair