Cengiz Signs!

[Guest Underfan]

3 minutes ago, coolhandfox said:

Hopefully it will make someone offer us a fee, one of the last bits of deadwood to go.

Besiktas is bankrupt, therefor no chance on that front.

[moore_94]

10 minutes ago, coolhandfox said:

I'm not convince Under was a pirmary target for RM, more of a decent short term stop gap and a opportunity to have a closer look.

 

I think we can if we have a fully fit back 4 and Wilf, however its been hard to do that this season.

 

Leading to achnage of shape which opened the door for Marc getting more game time and performing at a level that has made him hard to drop

 

I think we will see a more of Under in the next few weeks because of the overall workload. 

From memory, before Under we were linked with Trincao, McNeil, Ounas, Brooks, and probably a few others as well

 

No doubt some of them were a load of crap, but I think Under was definitely not our first choice, but seemingly the most favourable financially (and also probably the easiest to do as Roma seemed eager to get rid)

Edited 9 February 2021 by moore_94

[AKCJ]

You'd think we were benching Lionel Messi  

[moore_94]

Just now, AKCJ said:

You'd think we were benching Lionel Messi  

I would, doesn't defend enough 

[Deeg67]

33 minutes ago, Ric Flair said:

Rodgers has gone on record as saying he expects more goals from out wide. Barnes is doing that, Albrighton and Lerez aren't. He brings Ünder in and doesn't give him a chance even though the other two already still failing to provide what Rodgers is demanding. Ünder's defensive contribution is as good, if not better than Barnes as well. Hmmmmmm

Barnes is English tho.

 

For that matter, while I know it’s different for a player positioned up the center Maddison’s defensive contribution pretty much consists of the occasional yellow card emergency tackle when he’s caught out of position.  Doesn’t seem to bother Rodgers any.

 

Even setting aside this bizarre double standard, the notion that every attacking player has to be an elite defender to play is absurd on the face of it.  The aim of the sport is to score more goals than the opponent.  Both attacking and defending factor into it - lineup decisions should be made on the basis of the bottom line equation, period.  The fact is a great percent of the best attacking players in the world don’t defend for shlt.

 

 

[sacreblueits442]

2 hours ago, Dahnsouff said:

Sorry, that is no way a certainty, and if offering this chance depletes our defensive capability, why the hell would we take such a chance?  

 

 

....goes back to what I have said before, if Rodgers sees Ünder as a liability then why have him on the bench!!!

If every time he gets on he will be a liability to the team, so why is he on the bench. If he can't be trusted why is he still here.

[majaco]

This thread has been repetitive for several days.  Is it worth reading today's traffic?

[jayfox26]

5 minutes ago, majaco said:

This thread has been repetitive for several days.  Is it worth reading today's traffic?

No

[moore_94]

2 minutes ago, sacreblueits442 said:

....goes back to what I have said before, if Rodgers sees Ünder as a liability then why have him on the bench!!!

If every time he gets on he will be a liability to the team, so why is he on the bench. If he can't be trusted why is he still here.

Because it is called having squad depth, you really think we would cancel his loan (which we probably couldn't even if we wanted to) when there is every chance we probably wouldn't have been able to bring someone else in?

 

Brendan didn't say that he would be a liability every time he gets on, he referred to his defensive ability, games in Europa, cup games, league matches against the weaker sides and when we are losing is when Under is more likely to play because there will be less responsibility for him to defend

[Guest Underfan]

45 minutes ago, moore_94 said:

Transfermarkt also says the following players are ex internationals

 

James Maddison

Ricardo Pereira

Wilfred Ndidi

 

Miss some games through injury or don't get called up and they seem to put it as you have retired, which is not the case for any of those players or Thauvin

Well man last time When we played against French National team in in June 2019, their right wing was Mbappe, if Thauvin had not been on the bench, ı would recall and not confuse the dates maybe. Any way Turkey won 2-0 against France with a dominant performance.

Cengiz also starred against French National team and was great instrumental in our victory through a dominating performance and scored a goal. Below is a link

 

Edited 9 February 2021 by Underfan

[Deeg67]

I think it's illustrative to think of BR as a kind of anti-Cruyff, because predictability really seems to be the key metric he values.  If Cruyff preached total football Rodgers seems to prioritize "incremental football".  His ideal would be to be able to go take a dump in the middle of the match, come back, and as soon as he locates the ball know where every one of his players is within a one-meter circle.  Guys who float around a lot - Praet (who gets into unexpected positions very well - opposing defenders don't like it and neither does BR) and Under most obviously - are classed in a sort of "guilty until proven innocent" way and struggle to get on the pitch no matter how well they play.

 

The $64,000 question, then, is why bring guys like that in if they don't suit the manager?  It's not surprising to see them frozen out when they're not his sort of player.

[Heymister2015]

Personally the seasons are soooooo long and way too many games. We need Under,Thauvin and Otavio. Tieliamans/Barnes never get a rest! We have nothing as back up with Praet out! Lack of depth going forward 

[coolhandfox]

58 minutes ago, Underfan said:

Besiktas is bankrupt, therefor no chance on that front.

There are a few more team in the world then Besiktas who maybe interested.

[CrispinLA in Texas]

Hope he doesn't become another Kramaric for us

[murphy]

30 minutes ago, Deeg67 said:

 

The $64,000 question, then, is why bring guys like that in if they don't suit the manager?  It's not surprising to see them frozen out when they're not his sort of player.

 

Exactly.  I feel for the guy.  By taking him on loan, we have basically wasted a year of his career.  If he doesn't fit Rodger's profile we shouldn't have messed him around by bringing him here.

Edited 9 February 2021 by murphy

[Sunbury Fox]

3 minutes ago, murphy said:

 

Exactly.  I feel for the guy.  By taking him on loan, we have basically wasted a year of his career.  If he doesn't fit Rodger's profile we shouldn't have messed him around by bringing him here.

I have a feeling that Brendan backs himself to be able to coach any player to fit his style. He clearly could see that Ünder had attributes that would improve the team so he took a gamble that he could change him in other respects (pressing and defensive work). Unfortunately, however, it looks like an experiment that has failed. That's one theory anyway!

[HankMarvin]

1 hour ago, Facecloth said:

Erm, some of those crying aren't Turks. There's plenty of English fans moaning about him not playing.

Moaning or offering a different opinion to yours, after reading the last 6 pages about 70 percent is you replying to different people. Maybe just accept people all have their own opinions rather than telling them their wrong.

 

[Deeg67]

38 minutes ago, Sunbury Fox said:

I have a feeling that Brendan backs himself to be able to coach any player to fit his style. He clearly could see that Ünder had attributes that would improve the team so he took a gamble that he could change him in other respects (pressing and defensive work). Unfortunately, however, it looks like an experiment that has failed. That's one theory anyway!

Except his pressing and defensive work is better than Barnes or Maddison, and it doesn't seem to matter.  And Praet's pressing and defensive work is outstanding.  I think the no defending thing is just a cover, really.

[Sly]

Simply put, it could just be fitness or maybe he watches him day in, day out in training and just doesn’t fancy him. 

 

He bombed Gray off pretty early, despite the contract breakdowns. Under is basically Gray Mark II isn’t he? 

[gurru991]

2 hours ago, majaco said:

This thread has been repetitive for several days.  Is it worth reading today's traffic?

How many ways are there to say "he should play" or "he shouldn't play". It becomes tiresome after a while.

[KingsX]

2 hours ago, majaco said:

This thread has been repetitive for several days.  Is it worth reading today's traffic?

 

to save you the time ... combatants still at it, no judges' decision yet.

 

 

 

 

(personally I hope Cengo gets the chance and gives BR a big ol' selection problem going forward.)

[honeybradger]

It's just a bit disappointing that halfway through the year it looks like we might not have a settled choice for rw for next season yet again. It's not even just the ones we buy, the ones that we are linked with and dont buy tend to be underwhelming elswhere as well, trincao, pepe, sarr etc. Knowing our luck in this position i wouldnt be surprised is Thauvin fails to impress as well, i just really want Under to succeed before the end of the year because im tired of us gambling in that position every season with a new option.

[NaijaFox]

3 hours ago, moore_94 said:

From memory, before Under we were linked with Trincao, McNeil, Ounas, Brooks, and probably a few others as well

 

No doubt some of them were a load of crap, but I think Under was definitely not our first choice, but seemingly the most favourable financially (and also probably the easiest to do as Roma seemed eager to get rid)

Trincao was clearly our first choice, but the others were mostly speculation and rumours.

[blaaklint]

6 hours ago, HankMarvin said:

Would make perfect sense 

 

except Perez gets dribbled past the most of all 3 on average.

 

Perez averages

1.5 tackles a game.

0.5 interception.

Dribbled past

1.5

 

 Albrighton

1.1 tackle per game

0.6 interception.

Dribbled past

0.7

 

Under in the league (1 start 7 sub appearances)

0.6 tackle per game 

0.4 interception.

dribbled past

0.3

 

but europa league (5 starts 1 sub appearance)

1.2 tackles per game

0.4 interceptions 

dribbled past 

0.3

 

 

What is the definition of defensive discipline, it’s not like those number are beyond his reach.

unless it’s a case of not tracking back. Which I don’t follow him closely enough to know.

 

 

idk where you're getting your stats from but fbref, which uses the same stats provider as the club, has Perez down as making 3.65 tackles and interceptions per game, versus Under's 2.22 and Marc's 3.10. worth noting he also makes more pressures per game than under (21.9 against 14.8 per 90). even if you include the two previous years, there's no case to be made for under defensively.

[HankMarvin]

3 minutes ago, blaaklint said:

idk where you're getting your stats from but fbref, which uses the same stats provider as the club, has Perez down as making 3.65 tackles and interceptions per game, versus Under's 2.22 and Marc's 3.10. worth noting he also makes more pressures per game than under (21.9 against 14.8 per 90). even if you include the two previous years, there's no case to be made for under defensively.