Coronavirus Thread

[StanSP]

3 minutes ago, Col city fan said:

What a lot of hot air Stan! 

The reality is yes the government have certainly made mistakes, such as test and trace which has been a hugely expensive failure.

But so too have the public with their unwillingness to change and apply some common sense.

Do you REALLY believe what you are writing? (Not just you, but others) or are you still just playing the ‘blame game’?

There’s bloody conspiracy all over the place. 

I've not once said the public haven't made mistakes so let's not get too feisty here and start shouting about 'hot air'... 

 

[simFox]

36 minutes ago, Col city fan said:

What a lot of hot air Stan! 

The reality is yes the government have certainly made mistakes, such as test and trace which has been a hugely expensive failure.

But so too have the public with their unwillingness to change and apply some common sense.

Do you REALLY believe what you are writing? (Not just you, but others) or are you still just playing the ‘blame game’?

There’s bloody conspiracy all over the place. 

Do you work for the government?

[leicsmac]

Perhaps I'm just speculating here....but is it possible to suggest that the Government have ballsed up big time with their policy and the way they have delivered it and that certain elements of the public aren't prepared to use the common sense that they were born with out of reasons of ignorance or self-interest?

 

I don't think it has to be one or the other, or even one having much more effect than the other.

[yorkie1999]

32 minutes ago, leicsmac said:

Perhaps I'm just speculating here....but is it possible to suggest that the Government have ballsed up big time with their policy and the way they have delivered it and that certain elements of the public aren't prepared to use the common sense that they were born with out of reasons of ignorance or self-interest?

 

I don't think it has to be one or the other, or even one having much more effect than the other.

Listen to the science they said. We can defeat this with herd immunity, everyone was outraged, the nhs knew they would be overwhelmed if that happened, so they changed tactic. Well guess what, we could still end up with herd immunity but in a slighy controlled manner.

[stix]

8 hours ago, Mark 'expert' Lawrenson said:

It’s one of 5 or 6 points detailing how the government can make the restrictions even tighter.

 

Ive just read it online now. Thanks. 

[Dahnsouff]

5 hours ago, leicsmac said:

Perhaps I'm just speculating here....but is it possible to suggest that the Government have ballsed up big time with their policy and the way they have delivered it and that certain elements of the public aren't prepared to use the common sense that they were born with out of reasons of ignorance or self-interest?

 

I don't think it has to be one or the other, or even one having much more effect than the other.

It need not be the governments fault or the public’s fault, it is quite possible (likely) for it to be both.

I would suggest that

1. If the Government had acted differently, lives could have been saved
2. If the public had acted differently, lives could have been saved/

[Mark 'expert' Lawrenson]

7 hours ago, Corky said:

Oh well, at least 2021 will be better.

 

Will there be many pubs around by then?

Roll on 2022

[CosbehFox]

7 hours ago, Col city fan said:

What a lot of hot air Stan! 

The reality is yes the government have certainly made mistakes, such as test and trace which has been a hugely expensive failure.

But so too have the public with their unwillingness to change and apply some common sense.

Do you REALLY believe what you are writing? (Not just you, but others) or are you still just playing the ‘blame game’?

There’s bloody conspiracy all over the place. 

It’s the oldest trick in the book Col.  

 

Theres no doubt blame on the British public but any government prefers a divided nation. 
 

Some real strict rules being rumoured under consideration - allowed out of your house once a week!

Edited 11 January 2021 by Cardiff_Fox

[Pliskin]

1 hour ago, Dahnsouff said:

It need not be the governments fault or the public’s fault, it is quite possible (likely) for it to be both.

I would suggest that

1. If the Government had acted differently, lives could have been saved
2. If the public had acted differently, lives could have been saved/

It’s pretty much this to be fair. The government haven’t once led properly, they’ve been late to react to everything, allowed fellow colleagues to breach rules with no or extremely delayed repercussions, mixed messages unclear policies, stupid apps that don’t work and consistently back tracking on ideas... Frankly they have been laughable, naturally this kind of incompetence is seen by all, read by all, and not everyone will sing from the same hymn sheet, some members of the public will see this as an opportunity to breach the rules themselves.

 

In short, the way we have handled this pandemic has been a complete disaster, no need to compare ourselves to other nations..... we to look how we have dealt with it, which has been shit. And we does mean collectively.

[Dahnsouff]

3 minutes ago, Pliskin said:

It’s pretty much this to be fair. The government haven’t once led properly, they’ve been late to react to everything, allowed fellow colleagues to breach rules with no or extremely delayed repercussions, mixed messages unclear policies, stupid apps that don’t work and consistently back tracking on ideas... Frankly they have been laughable, naturally this kind of incompetence is seen by all, read by all, and not everyone will sing from the same hymn sheet, some members of the public will see this as an opportunity to breach the rules themselves.

 

In short, the way we have handled this pandemic has been a complete disaster, no need to compare ourselves to other nations..... we to look how we have dealt with it, which has been shit. And we does mean collectively.

 Cheeky. I was trying to put a unifying middle ground position out there, but you have wilfully shifted the blame back almost exclusively back to the government. (Who hold a lot of the blame, don`t mistake me)

 

I could have referenced my point another way, no one group, public nor government, fixes this on its own. 

[ealingfox]

As I've asked several times now, if anyone has any actual evidence of the extent to which non-compliance has driven transmission, then please share it.

 

Until then I'm going to continue to believe that structural factors are a far greater proponent and that you dont get 50000 infections a day because a few people go for walks slightly further from their house than their street.

[Pliskin]

47 minutes ago, Cardiff_Fox said:

It’s the oldest trick in the book Col.  

 

Theres no doubt blame on the British public but any government prefers a divided nation. 
 

Some real strict rules being rumoured under consideration - allowed out of your house once a week!

Rules like the last you mention just Wouk be impossible to police..... they just need to shut everything excluding supermarkets.... and would probably include schools at this time too like the first lockdown..... I mean my Mrs office is still open, and my office is still open.... my Mrs office is a construction office where some of her colleagues just don’t want to work at home anymore so they’ve managed to get a key worker letter from work.... but they work in an IT department? They were working from home in the first lockdown? So why cant they now? 
 

There needs to be some real clarity with who “key workers” are, there are a number of offices open and people working in them that could be working at home. 
 

My office is the same we have people who are refusing to work from home so have taken advantage of the fact our company does have areas containing key and critical workers so they’re managing to get key worker letters.... but they aren’t key workers? 
 

There’s always a loophole that some people and wriggle through, and this is another thing that needs to be addressed! 

Edited 11 January 2021 by Pliskin

[Pliskin]

16 minutes ago, Dahnsouff said:

 Cheeky. I was trying to put a unifying middle ground position out there, but you have wilfully shifted the blame back almost exclusively back to the government. (Who hold a lot of the blame, don`t mistake me)

 

I could have referenced my point another way, no one group, public nor government, fixes this on its own. 

Haha not at all! You’re right both are to blame! It has been a collective failure from everyone one. Like my post below shows, people j know of and work with taking advantage of their companies position with some sections having key workers.... so they can get hold of key worker letters when they are not. Last week one of my offices was full, it had 20 or so staff in it.... that isn’t really the governments fault, that is the company’s fault for allowing it to happen, and the workers being too selfish and not wanting to stay at home, because that what most of them said “I can’t work at home anymore, kids are driving me mad”. 
 

One thing I think the government can do is add a bit more clarity so for example say;

 

Key workers are...... and that be final.

 

But you are completely correct, people behaviour has been deplorable, and we can make a massive difference to this by being sensible, considerate of others and doing are absolute best to minimise any contact with others. But a lot of people haven’t, and here we are.

Edited 11 January 2021 by Pliskin

[Mark 'expert' Lawrenson]

10 hours ago, BenTheFox said:

Absolutely. You'd almost forget that they were too slow to lock the country down in March and allowed people to enter the country without a negative test or quarantine and spent billions on a track and trace system that doesn't work. 

Add to that the craziest decision yet when they put London into tier 2 in December whilst most of the rest of us were tier 3. This is London, the capital, where lots and lots of people live together in close proximity 

Oh how they must have smirked with self satisfaction looking after themselves before Christmas, pubs open etc what a jolly good time they must of had whilst the the rest of us could do very little.

Scandalous.

And if I sound bitter it’s because I am.

 

 

[The Fox Covert]

The scariest thing about the rumours about further restrictions and an enhanced lockdown is that the minister in charge is Priti Patel. About as little regard for personal liberty as the manhole cover in my street.

[OrielCaziado]

Sport to stop and allowed out once a week. I’m dreading that but how must people who live alone or live in small houses with big families be feeling. Horrendous for some. Imagine living in a bedsit and having to get through that. 

[StriderHiryu]

38 minutes ago, Mark 'expert' Lawrenson said:

Add to that the craziest decision yet when they put London into tier 2 in December whilst most of the rest of us were tier 3. This is London, the capital, where lots and lots of people live together in close proximity 

Oh how they must have smirked with self satisfaction looking after themselves before Christmas, pubs open etc what a jolly good time they must of had whilst the the rest of us could do very little.

Scandalous.

And if I sound bitter it’s because I am.

 

 

I live in London and I 100% agree with you on this. It was madness at the time, everyone knew it was madness, and yet it went ahead anyway. All for what? So a few businesses could earn a few more quid during Christmas shopping, which will now be offset by not being open for months on end as cases spiral out of control. Absolutely moronic decision that was only ever going to end one way.

 

I would like to say that I don't think most Londoners were smug about it though. If restrictions are relaxed, people are going to take advantage of that, it's just human nature to do so. But the point is those restrictions should not have been eased up at all. And at the end of the day, it backfired because we were put into tier 4 for Christmas day itself, and personally that resulted in spending Christmas by myself.

 

I wouldn't trust this government to be able to tie a shoelace yet alone prepare a response for a global health pandemic. Elect a clown and end up with a circus. 

[leicsmac]

52 minutes ago, ealingfox said:

As I've asked several times now, if anyone has any actual evidence of the extent to which non-compliance has driven transmission, then please share it.

 

Until then I'm going to continue to believe that structural factors are a far greater proponent and that you dont get 50000 infections a day because a few people go for walks slightly further from their house than their street.

I think this could well just be circumstantial, but take a look at outbreak data relative to other countries compared to the UK.

 

Those who have done better certainly seem to have been also better at social distancing, mask wearing and other generally reasonable things.

 

Of course, it could just be that their governments were collectively much more on the ball from the start, but I think it's a stretch to think that's responsible for the relative success of all of them.

[Sampson]

Where are these rumours that sport will stop people are talking about above?

[Col city fan]

17 minutes ago, Sampson said:

Where are these rumours that sport will stop people are talking about above?

A few players have ‘flouted the rules’ over the weekend, visiting to watch other matches, group hugs after scoring goals, group hugs in the changing rooms afterwards etc

The ‘authorities’ are apparently not best chuffed and are looking into it re considering a bigger clamp down 

To my mind, yet more examples of where the few potentially could ruin it for the many.

Looking forward to watching footy has been one of the things keeping me going!

Edited 11 January 2021 by Col city fan

[dsr-burnley]

1 hour ago, Pliskin said:

One thing I think the government can do is add a bit more clarity so for example say;

 

Key workers are...... and that be final.

Unfortunately I don't think that would be possible.  

 

For example, I'm a self-employed accountant.  Key worker?  No.  You would think.  

 

But what about a self-employed accountant who runs payroll for a care agency?  Surely a key worker.  I don't think it is possible to produce a definitive list that won't have issues.

[The People's Hero]

6 minutes ago, dsr-burnley said:

Unfortunately I don't think that would be possible.  

 

For example, I'm a self-employed accountant.  Key worker?  No.  You would think.  

 

But what about a self-employed accountant who runs payroll for a care agency?  Surely a key worker.  I don't think it is possible to produce a definitive list that won't have issues.

Correct.

 

Certain sectors also can't just stop working regardless of whether they even deal with key industry or key workers. I for example run an insurance company and due to the FCA rules and principles, we HAVE to work since we must be available to service our clients.

 

This is fine, because we can do so from home; but you can see where further issues can occur, since sometimes there are other external authority influences which mean the show simply has to go on.

[BenTheFox]

1 hour ago, OrielCaziado said:

Sport to stop and allowed out once a week. I’m dreading that but how must people who live alone or live in small houses with big families be feeling. Horrendous for some. Imagine living in a bedsit and having to get through that. 

I had coronavirus back in September and I was living in a shared house. I couldn't leave my room for 14 days, I was losing my mind. 

[reynard]

1 hour ago, StriderHiryu said:

I live in London and I 100% agree with you on this. It was madness at the time, everyone knew it was madness, and yet it went ahead anyway. All for what? So a few businesses could earn a few more quid during Christmas shopping, which will now be offset by not being open for months on end as cases spiral out of control. Absolutely moronic decision that was only ever going to end one way.

 

I would like to say that I don't think most Londoners were smug about it though. If restrictions are relaxed, people are going to take advantage of that, it's just human nature to do so. But the point is those restrictions should not have been eased up at all. And at the end of the day, it backfired because we were put into tier 4 for Christmas day itself, and personally that resulted in spending Christmas by myself.

 

I wouldn't trust this government to be able to tie a shoelace yet alone prepare a response for a global health pandemic. Elect a clown and end up with a circus. 

I'm no defender of the Governement who have botched the whole thing from start to now on the whole but they weren't the only ones thinking London should have been put into Tier 2

https://www.london.gov.uk/press-releases/mayoral/reaction-to-tier-2-announement

[ealingfox]

1 hour ago, leicsmac said:

I think this could well just be circumstantial, but take a look at outbreak data relative to other countries compared to the UK.

 

Those who have done better certainly seem to have been also better at social distancing, mask wearing and other generally reasonable things.

 

Of course, it could just be that their governments were collectively much more on the ball from the start, but I think it's a stretch to think that's responsible for the relative success of all of them.

 

That's supposition, not evidence.