Youri Tielemans

[Costock_Fox]

Not a single mention of the LCFC Twitter account using the words “best season yet” for Youri? This place has gone down hill rapidly.

 

We would have had spies, plane tracking and Big Daddy a few years ago. Vile.

[Albert]

2 hours ago, An Sionnach said:

You are right ,we haven't , because our mind set is we can't compete . That leaves us in the 7- 10 section of the P. L. But we are in the top 20 club sides in Europe if not in the world so that shouldn't be good enough.

Our mindset might be able to compete for established players in cuckoo land but in the real World where money exists we can only compete for players we can afford 

[LestaFox92]

Off to the euro's apparently gonna miss him what a player he was for us.

[An Sionnach]

57 minutes ago, Albert said:

Our mindset might be able to compete for established players in cuckoo land but in the real World where money exists we can only compete for players we can afford 

St.Etienne pushed us to 30 million for Fofana, an extraordinary amount of money for  a 19 y.o. CB and probably a world record. It seems money can be found when necessary. We also are owned by a very rich family unlike say Crystal Palace. We have to believe that when a desirable player becomes available we should be competitive otherwise we will be stuck in the second group of the premiership.

[Raw Dykes]

1 hour ago, An Sionnach said:

St.Etienne pushed us to 30 million for Fofana, an extraordinary amount of money for  a 19 y.o. CB and probably a world record. It seems money can be found when necessary. We also are owned by a very rich family unlike say Crystal Palace. We have to believe that when a desirable player becomes available we should be competitive otherwise we will be stuck in the second group of the premiership.

Money can be found, indeed. Chilwell was sold for £50m.

 

We're not in a position to compete with the rich clubs when going for the same players. They can blow us out of the water on wages.

 

That isn't to say we're stuck in the second group of the PL, though. We've won the cvnt and very narrowly missed out on top 4 the last two seasons. What we're doing is working.

[iancognito]

1 hour ago, An Sionnach said:

St.Etienne pushed us to 30 million for Fofana, an extraordinary amount of money for  a 19 y.o. CB and probably a world record. It seems money can be found when necessary. We also are owned by a very rich family unlike say Crystal Palace. We have to believe that when a desirable player becomes available we should be competitive otherwise we will be stuck in the second group of the premiership.

That very rich family are shrewd businessmen & women. Look back over the years, very little of their personal money has gone into this club. It's always been player sales & reinvestment or TV and PL money being used for the day-to-day running.

[Claridge]

4 hours ago, iancognito said:

That very rich family are shrewd businessmen & women. Look back over the years, very little of their personal money has gone into this club. It's always been player sales & reinvestment or TV and PL money being used for the day-to-day running.

Bought a round for 30,000 people a couple of times

[UHDrive]

29 minutes ago, Claridge said:

Bought a round for 30,000 people a couple of times

I'll have a Claridge's on tap please 😉

 

[Carl the Llama]

Norwich love selling their best players to mid-table PL clubs from the midlands.

[MGLCFC]

4 minutes ago, Carl the Llama said:

Norwich love selling their best players to mid-table PL clubs from the midlands.

We're hardly classed as mid table these days. 😁

[Carl the Llama]

Just now, MGLCFC said:

We're hardly classed as mid table these days. 😁

When we signed Madders we'd just finished 9th, no?

[MGLCFC]

Just now, Carl the Llama said:

When we signed Madders we'd just finished 9th, no?

Yeah, but that was just a blip👍

[gerblod]

On 05/06/2021 at 12:31, Babylon said:

"Nothing about Grealish", except you've mentioned him, his club and the supposed fee they want for him. 

 

Yeah, which you related to Jack Grealish. And as I pointed about his value and worth are dictated my numerous factors, with two years left we aren't remotely in the position of power Aston Villa are to demand ridiculous fees. Which, as I already pointed out they wouldn't get. Because they'll get offered £70m, the player kick off and he'll end up going where he wants for the vastly reduced amount. 

 

When people give amounts, they are talking realistic amounts we're going to get. Not the amounts we should ask for as some half baked negotiating tactic. 

 

But the situation is entirely different, we're in the position whereby next summer his value is vastly reduced due to having one year left. Villa aren't in the same position for two years, oh and they are't going to get £130m in a million years and would likely lose the player for around half the amount, should be want to leave. 

 

There is a tax on English players because of the quotas / homegrown players etc. If you don't understand that, then god help you. 

 

 

A very thorough riposte - but it appears to me that you've taken what was an essentially lighthearted initial post to belabour several points that aren't really, for me anyway, worth the time and effort.

It was not about Grealish - I was merely using Agbonlahor's statement as illustrative to Tielemans putative worth. Substitute any name for "Grealish" - a player who might be in a similar position. You're just pushing an interpretation - for whatever purpose.

What is a "ridiculous" fee in modern football? Neymar to PSG? If a club want a player badly enough and they have the resources then ridiculous is a subjective assessment to each individual who deems it attention worthy.

Whether Tielemans would "kick off" if a figure of £70m is offered kind of invalidates your point. My post was about Tielemans. Or did you mean him in your 2nd para., final sentence when you referred to "the player kick off"? He doesn't appear to be the 'kicking-off' kind.

All negotiations start off with negotiating tactics - it's not "half-baked" - it's the way business works. The seller might ask for, for example, £130m. However ridiculous that may seem, the buyer has two choices - walk away or negotiate. You have a point - Tielemans position is different to any other player - it's unique.

My point in asking what he is worth to City has more to do than with what his market value might be. If he remains at City then the team can consolidate around him and, hopefully, maintain their push for a CL place. He is, to my mind, the pivotal figure upon which our play is based. The difference between what he's worth to us and what he's worth to Liverpool might just be £20m + - if City make that CL place.

As to your final comment - no, it's true, I don't fully understand the implications of quotas and tax on domestic and foreign player transfer deals. They are often labyrinthine enough without the added tax implications. I have enough trouble understanding my own tax situation.

However, I suspect about 80% of the fellow posters on here don't either, but I trust in God and he will help me - perhaps he/she will guide you into enlightening me with an example.

 

[gerblod]

On 05/06/2021 at 09:54, Grebfromgrebland said:

Difference is that grealish might want to stay at villa whilst Tielemans might want to leave Leicester.

 

That will affect the valuation.

And vice-versa but you're not wrong!

[Col city fan]

17 hours ago, Carl the Llama said:

Norwich love selling their best players to mid-table PL clubs from the midlands.

They don’t have a lot of dosh to be fair. Their manager has worked wonders at Norwich really.

[gerblod]

On 05/06/2021 at 11:23, gerblod said:

This stuff about Covid affecting a players worth just does not apply to those clubs whose resources are derived from consumer necessities. Abramovitch and Mansour will have experienced Covid as a tiny blip in their income graphs.

They'll, regular as clockwork, be able to finance buying up to the financial constraints set out by the football governing body.

I'd be laughing myself around the floor if Chelsea came to me (as Top) and said they couldn't afford more than £70m for Youri. 

In fact, replying to my own post, what happens is that Chelsea/Man City/United et al will have a shopping list and a wallet full of dosh. They might decide they need a goalie more than any other position. So that will be where their negotiating will be most limited. Then they'll prioritise down the line. They might need a midfielder and Tielemans is a prospect, but they'll test the water with say £50m -  to see if City bite. If they can get him for £65m then they're singing all the way home. If it's £90m then they'll look somewhere else for someone cheaper.

 

The Liverpool media fan club have already been setting out the scenario. I've just read a piece by some Liverpool chump called Michael Mongle.

 

"Manager told he can’t stop 24-year-old moving to Liverpool after price is set. After Kevin Phillips told Football Insider that Brendan Rodgers can’t stop Youri Tielemans from moving to Liverpool, the Leicester Mercury claims it will cost around £70m to sign him".*

 

I don't know who/which is worse - Mongle, Phillips (who's getting paid by 'Football Insider') or the effing Mercury. But it's all intended to upset the apple-cart at Leicester.

 

*(Website https://www.anfieldcentral.co.uk/posts/leicester-will-demand-70m-for-youri-tielemans/)

[Babylon]

2 hours ago, gerblod said:

A very thorough riposte - but it appears to me that you've taken what was an essentially lighthearted initial post to belabour several points that aren't really, for me anyway, worth the time and effort.

It was not about Grealish - I was merely using Agbonlahor's statement as illustrative to Tielemans putative worth. Substitute any name for "Grealish" - a player who might be in a similar position. You're just pushing an interpretation - for whatever purpose.

What is a "ridiculous" fee in modern football? Neymar to PSG? If a club want a player badly enough and they have the resources then ridiculous is a subjective assessment to each individual who deems it attention worthy.

Whether Tielemans would "kick off" if a figure of £70m is offered kind of invalidates your point. My post was about Tielemans. Or did you mean him in your 2nd para., final sentence when you referred to "the player kick off"? He doesn't appear to be the 'kicking-off' kind.

All negotiations start off with negotiating tactics - it's not "half-baked" - it's the way business works. The seller might ask for, for example, £130m. However ridiculous that may seem, the buyer has two choices - walk away or negotiate. You have a point - Tielemans position is different to any other player - it's unique.

My point in asking what he is worth to City has more to do than with what his market value might be. If he remains at City then the team can consolidate around him and, hopefully, maintain their push for a CL place. He is, to my mind, the pivotal figure upon which our play is based. The difference between what he's worth to us and what he's worth to Liverpool might just be £20m + - if City make that CL place.

As to your final comment - no, it's true, I don't fully understand the implications of quotas and tax on domestic and foreign player transfer deals. They are often labyrinthine enough without the added tax implications. I have enough trouble understanding my own tax situation.

However, I suspect about 80% of the fellow posters on here don't either, but I trust in God and he will help me - perhaps he/she will guide you into enlightening me with an example.

 

If you are going to bring up another clubs (supposed) stance on their player and use it as a comparison, then you have to compare the situations of that player (or any other player) and the player of ours you are talking about.

 

We are in a far weaker position to make huge demands than Villa, or any other club, when their player has two years left and ours doesn’t it’s as simple as that. 
 

We can put a huge figure on it that nobody will pay, I mean you might as well just say he’s not for sale, because it’s not being paid by anyone. But all that does is punt the issue down the road to a point where we are in an even weaker negotiating position. 
 

We are a club that has operated by maximising value of a player and then reinvesting that money are more players. That has been our MO, play hardball all we want, but eventually the player goes. We can either make money on it and reinvest, or lose him for less than we paid. 

[st albans fox]

I think this is where we are on YT

he has seen us spend two seasons fighting for top four and failing on the last day due to squad depth.  
he is happy to stay but he won’t stay unless he perceives that the club can match his ambitions 

That means making him our highest earner (by some margin) and spending sig money in several areas (without damaging squad depth via sales).  As an example, he would accept hamza moving on but not a cags or madders.  we cannot end up with less ‘capable  bodies’ than we started after the window. And we need to have more !  
 

I don’t believe that we are financially able to do that. I hope the club surprise us in this regard but expect that the model we have used thus far will continue. For that reason, I expect YT to leave this summer (and we could be forced to accept a lower fee than most of you think we should to avoid him leaving for £25m next summer). We won’t keep a player who wants to go. That’s not rodgers way imo. 

Edited 7 June 2021 by st albans fox

[hejammy]

1 hour ago, st albans fox said:

I think this is where we are on YT

he has seen us spend two seasons fighting for top four and failing on the last day due to squad depth.  
he is happy to stay but he won’t stay unless he perceives that the club can match his ambitions 

That means making him our highest earner (by some margin) and spending sig money in several areas (without damaging squad depth via sales).  As an example, he would accept hamza moving on but not a cags or madders.  we cannot end up with less ‘capable  bodies’ than we started after the window. And we need to have more !  
 

I don’t believe that we are financially able to do that. I hope the club surprise us in this regard but expect that the model we have used thus far will continue. For that reason, I expect YT to leave this summer (and we could be forced to accept a lower fee than most of you think we should to avoid him leaving for £25m next summer). We won’t keep a player who wants to go. That’s not rodgers way imo. 

But where does this statement come from? How do you know he wants to go? Allegedly he is very happy here, his family is happy and settled here and that is important to him? 

[st albans fox]

1 hour ago, hejammy said:

But where does this statement come from? How do you know he wants to go? Allegedly he is very happy here, his family is happy and settled here and that is important to him? 

I wrote ‘he is happy here’

 

but he wont stay to go through the heartache of end of season let down for a third time. Our lack of quality squad depth is the issue and I’m certain he wants to see that addressed. If we buy Bertrand, soulmare, edouard and a wide player, offer him 175k/week with a viable exit clause (that works for both parties) and only sell a couple who are lower quality then unless a club is going to pay £80m for him, I think he stays.  My point at the end was that I doubt we can afford to do all of that.

[filthyfox]

He is not worth a penny less than 80m.

[Chocolate Teapot]

On 05/06/2021 at 08:33, gerblod said:

I'm just in the middle of going through BBC Red Button football headlines gossip column.

 

This snippet caught my attention: "...Jack Grealish, 25, could stay at the club this summer, with both Manchester City and Manchester United unwilling to match Villa's £130m valuation, according to ex-Villa captain Gabriel Agbonlahor. (Talksport).

 

Makes anything less than £100m for Youri look a trifle insipid, don't it? 

Agree. If villa want 130m for grealish then youri is worth more, factor in his contract and anything below 80m is a scandal based on that.

[Ric Flair]

I'd be very surprised if Tielemans doesn't sign a new deal with an agreement with Top that should we not get top 4 next season then he can leave for £70m next summer. He'll sign a 2 year extension and enjoy the best part of a 100% pay rise for at least a year here.

[SecretPro]

2 hours ago, Ric Flair said:

I'd be very surprised if Tielemans doesn't sign a new deal with an agreement with Top that should we not get top 4 next season then he can leave for £70m next summer. He'll sign a 2 year extension and enjoy the best part of a 100% pay rise for at least a year here.

This, but it's a 10 year extension. I just watched him sign it.

[StanSP]