Choudhury

[CosbehFox]

17 minutes ago, hejammy said:

Mendy is also a "headless chicken" type of player. His positioning sometimes is awful. Often doesn't get on the right side of the player. Also what really annoys me about Mendy is that he always passes either sideways or back even when he really doesn't have to. It's very frustrating when he breaks up our forward play. 

If you want to talk about positioning, take a look at the Cavaleiro shot which went just past the post after half time. Choudhury rather than screening and passing on Loftus Cheek, followed Loftus Cheek leaving a huge gap to get the pass/feed in Cavaleiro 

[Clever Fox]

Credit to him tonight as he was under a lot of pressure to deliver, And he done well for the most part. Played a part in both Goals and got in a few goal saving tackles.

 

Yes, He can be happy with his performance, but he needs to add more mobility and improve his long range passing.

[kyleolly]

The only thing that frustrated me was when he has the ball he barely passes forward or advances forward with the ball at one point tonight he had about 40 yards of space in front of him but did a 180 and passed it back to a defender!

[moore_94]

17 minutes ago, Marshall Cockney Fox said:

Is that based on stats or your perception? 

 

17 minutes ago, hejammy said:

What? Just what? Mendy is a more progressive passer than Ndidi? I suppose Pérez is a better striker than Vardy? 

https://fbref.com/en/squads/a2d435b3/Leicester-City-Stats#all_stats_passing_10728

 

Passes into the final third

Mendy - 69

Ndidi - 25

 

Progressive passes - completed passes that move the ball towards the opponents goal at least 10 yards (excludes passes from the defending 40% of the pitch)

Mendy - 45

Ndidi - 18

 

Shot creating actions per 90

Mendy - 0.87

Ndidi - 0.42

 

Ndidi plays more passes forward (220 yards per 90 minutes vs 202 yards per 90 minutes) but Mendys passes carry the ball further and are more effective at creating a shooting opportunity

[peach0000]

He rarely ever lets us down and is a solid player. I've never really got the stick he gets on here, especially as he's one of our own. Love seeing local lads playing for us. 

[hejammy]

7 minutes ago, moore_94 said:

 

https://fbref.com/en/squads/a2d435b3/Leicester-City-Stats#all_stats_passing_10728

 

Passes into the final third

Mendy - 69

Ndidi - 25

 

Progressive passes - completed passes that move the ball towards the opponents goal at least 10 yards (excludes passes from the defending 40% of the pitch)

Mendy - 45

Ndidi - 18

 

Shot creating actions per 90

Mendy - 0.87

Ndidi - 0.42

 

Ndidi plays more passes forward (220 yards per 90 minutes vs 202 yards per 90 minutes) but Mendys passes carry the ball further and are more effective at creating a shooting opportunity

The first two stats are number of times. How can you use that as a fair comparison when Mendy has had more game time? 

[Swalshed]

21 minutes ago, Claridge said:

Did well against a Fulham side, that I as a fat, smoking, knackered knee, functioning alcoholic would still fancy his chances against

Is that really you Super Steve?

[honeybradger]

Bit of a rough diamond player but definitely doesnt deserve half the stick he gets on here, good performance.

[blaaklint]

8 minutes ago, hejammy said:

The first two stats are number of times. How can you use that as a fair comparison when Mendy has had more game time? 

If you adjust the stats per 90, you get:

Passes into final third:

Mendy - 0.29

Ndidi - 0.21

 

Progressive passes:

Mendy - 3.26

Ndidi - 1.88

 

Worth noting that Mendy also carries the ball at his feet further forwards more often. I don't think that makes up for Ndidi's sheer monstrous defensive output, but Mendy is better with the ball.

[Bert]

24 minutes ago, shailen said:

He's better on the ball then Mendy but his decision making is sometimes really rash. I'd rather have him in over Mendy where teams drop off as he can do more with it and has chipped in with a few goals too. 

What?! Mendy is probably one of our best players on the ball  

 

Hamza played well, did what was asked of him. 

[berniethebolt]

Struggling to understand the comparison of Mendy and Hamza, Mendy for me is comfortably several steps ahead of him in squad selection and a decent understudy to Nididi. Certainly proved this at the start of the season.

 

Hamza does have age on his side and easy to forget he is 23 and a good few years from what you'd class as a footballers peak. 

 

Teams like Fulham are perfect for him play, hold his own and develop, however against tougher higher calibre opposition hes a yard slower for me which is often behind a late tackle and early booking and gets caught in pocession.

 

Hopefully keeps moving forward toward and contributes as a decent squad player. Worth working with as his contract will be good value for a premier league player im sure.

 

 

[shailen]

17 minutes ago, Bert said:

What?! Mendy is probably one of our best players on the ball  

 

Hamza played well, did what was asked of him. 

I don't see this personally. He's good at playing the ball sideways but I've never seen him drive with the ball and make a forward telling pass. Against teams like Fulham we lose a creative player in this regards whereas Hamza has better stability imo in attack and defence. 

[majaco]

55 minutes ago, Sharpe's Fox said:

One good half isn't enough to sway me.

Have a pint then.  

[whoareyaaa]

done well, passing was rusty and all over the place but overall done enough to cause them a bit of trouble in the middle I think.

[UniFox21]

First goal came from Hamza regaining possession, did well in what he was asked to do. Love how Rodgers managed it in telling him he'd play should his move not happen.

[Jobyfox]

I think Hamza played well first half, but faded a bit second half. I still think he's not quite worked out what sort of player he wants to be. I think he could be more aggressive carrying the ball rather than just picking the safe pass. He's got decent pace and a good shot on him, but rarely takes any risks. 

 

In terms of N'didi v Mendy then I don't really understand why people would question that NM is the more progressive passer. For me he's best when we play a back three and his job is to recycle the ball and play it forward. 

 

I wouldn't have anybody other than Wilf when we're playing a back four though. He's an absolute monster in screening the defence, which is so important in terms of letting the creative players push forward. 

 

I'd go:

N'didi with 4 at the back

Mendy with 5 or 3 at the back

Hamza - when he's worked out what he is and puts in some consistent performances to the extent that swapping him with Chalobah seems even more ridiculous than it was on deadline day. 

Edited 3 February 2021 by Jobyfox

[OhYesNdidi]

Thought he played really well today! Fulham are gash though 

[deep blue]

1 hour ago, OhYesNdidi said:

Thought he played really well today! Fulham are gash though 

For all that they're gash, they beat us earlier at the KP though.

[Fox92]

He was ok. Wouldn't say he was excellent.

 

It helped that Fulham are poor finishers.

Edited 4 February 2021 by Fox92

[Frank Large's Black Book]

I recall that when Chilwell left someone posted the question "Who will be the new whipping boy".

It seems Hamza is coming up on the rails.

I'm not trying to stop discussion, I just find some of it destructive.

[Bert]

Watch the goals back from last night. Wins the ball and starts the move for the first. Starts the move for the second. Dunno why our own fans are just out to skate the players. 

[Finnegan]

1 minute ago, Bert said:

Watch the goals back from last night. Wins the ball and starts the move for the first. Starts the move for the second. Dunno why our own fans are just out to skate the players. 

 

I'd say two things to that, really:

 

Firstly, the whole premise of this thread in the first place was to set up a Mendy vs Hamza debate and, I'm sorry, Mendy is just comfortably better on the ball. He's by far our best defensive midfielder when it comes to actual talent with a ball at his feet. He moves well, passes well and is nearly always looking to be progressive. I wouldn't want him to be our main playmaker but for a holding midfielder he's a decent footballer. 

 

Secondly, Hamza's actual in the team to screen the defence, hold shape and win the ball back when the opportunity arrises. At this he is catastrophically hit and miss. His football intelligence regards defensive positioning and awareness is barely Championship standard, he's a long, long way short of being good enough for this level. That's why he barely gets a kick here. 

 

Nobody whatsoever doubts his work ethic, his fitness, his aggression and his willingness to bleed for the team. In a compact game where we're sitting in with a deep block and everyone else is in position, he can be let off the leash to just chase the ball like a dog at the park and that's where he shines. Games like "THAT" match at Anfield where all of foxestalk acted like he was the second coming of Ngolo Kante, he didn't need positional awareness or any tactical sense because the rest of the team was set up to condense the field and slow Liverpool down, freeing Hamza up to just charge after the ball and destroy. It was great. 

 

The problem is, we don't defend like that most of the time. We want to be on the front foot, so a lot of the work our defensive midfielder does is just holding position like a rugby union full back, ready to mop up the ball, recycle, stop counter attacks and keep us on the front foot. Hamza doesn't do that stuff well because he's too often charging off after the ball round the pitch or hovering in spaces that make no real sense because he looks like he doesn't know where to be. 

 

It doesn't have to be about "slating" the lad, there's a lot to like about Hamza and its all on top of the fact he seems to be a hard working, likeable and down to earth kid. But let's not pretend there's any reason he's not been in the team this year other than the fact he's just not good enough. 

 

Anyone thinking he's been mistreated and he's actually secretly better than Mendy isn't just a bit naive, they've totally lost the plot. 

 

I like Hamza, I do, but if we're debating whether or not he's better than Papy, sorry, that's just not a debate. 

[Bert]

8 minutes ago, Finnegan said:

 

I'd say two things to that, really:

 

Firstly, the whole premise of this thread in the first place was to set up a Mendy vs Hamza debate and, I'm sorry, Mendy is just comfortably better on the ball. He's by far our best defensive midfielder when it comes to actual talent with a ball at his feet. He moves well, passes well and is nearly always looking to be progressive. I wouldn't want him to be our main playmaker but for a holding midfielder he's a decent footballer. 

 

Secondly, Hamza's actual in the team to screen the defence, hold shape and win the ball back when the opportunity arrises. At this he is catastrophically hit and miss. His football intelligence regards defensive positioning and awareness is barely Championship standard, he's a long, long way short of being good enough for this level. That's why he barely gets a kick here. 

 

Nobody whatsoever doubts his work ethic, his fitness, his aggression and his willingness to bleed for the team. In a compact game where we're sitting in with a deep block and everyone else is in position, he can be let off the leash to just chase the ball like a dog at the park and that's where he shines. Games like "THAT" match at Anfield where all of foxestalk acted like he was the second coming of Ngolo Kante, he didn't need positional awareness or any tactical sense because the rest of the team was set up to condense the field and slow Liverpool down, freeing Hamza up to just charge after the ball and destroy. It was great. 

 

The problem is, we don't defend like that most of the time. We want to be on the front foot, so a lot of the work our defensive midfielder does is just holding position like a rugby union full back, ready to mop up the ball, recycle, stop counter attacks and keep us on the front foot. Hamza doesn't do that stuff well because he's too often charging off after the ball round the pitch or hovering in spaces that make no real sense because he looks like he doesn't know where to be. 

 

It doesn't have to be about "slating" the lad, there's a lot to like about Hamza and its all on top of the fact he seems to be a hard working, likeable and down to earth kid. But let's not pretend there's any reason he's not been in the team this year other than the fact he's just not good enough. 

 

Anyone thinking he's been mistreated and he's actually secretly better than Mendy isn't just a bit naive, they've totally lost the plot. 

 

I like Hamza, I do, but if we're debating whether or not he's better than Papy, sorry, that's just not a debate. 

Yep, and if you’ll read back when quoting Shailen, you’ll see that I’ve said Mendy is one of our best players on the ball. 
 

I wasn’t talking about Wolves away or what Hamza has or hasn’t done previously, simply last night. He had a big hand in both goals and for 60 minutes he protected a back 5 which kept a clean sheet. Yet people were still slating him which I thought was unfair. 
 

Mendy has been one of our best players this season and I don’t think anyone has questioned why he’s started over Hamza. I think the only thing Hamza has over Mendy is tackling. 
 

Last night was the right game for Hamza instead of Mendy and the performance and result proved so. 

[HankMarvin]

14 hours ago, moore_94 said:

 

https://fbref.com/en/squads/a2d435b3/Leicester-City-Stats#all_stats_passing_10728

 

Passes into the final third

Mendy - 69

Ndidi - 25

 

Progressive passes - completed passes that move the ball towards the opponents goal at least 10 yards (excludes passes from the defending 40% of the pitch)

Mendy - 45

Ndidi - 18

 

Shot creating actions per 90

Mendy - 0.87

Ndidi - 0.42

 

Ndidi plays more passes forward (220 yards per 90 minutes vs 202 yards per 90 minutes) but Mendys passes carry the ball further and are more effective at creating a shooting opportunity

What the stats for last season?

 

are the first 2 stats you showed there per 90mins? As Mendy has played about 40% more games?

[coolhandfox]

13 minutes ago, Finnegan said:

 

I'd say two things to that, really:

 

Firstly, the whole premise of this thread in the first place was to set up a Mendy vs Hamza debate and, I'm sorry, Mendy is just comfortably better on the ball. He's by far our best defensive midfielder when it comes to actual talent with a ball at his feet. He moves well, passes well and is nearly always looking to be progressive. I wouldn't want him to be our main playmaker but for a holding midfielder he's a decent footballer. 

 

Secondly, Hamza's actual in the team to screen the defence, hold shape and win the ball back when the opportunity arrises. At this he is catastrophically hit and miss. His football intelligence regards defensive positioning and awareness is barely Championship standard, he's a long, long way short of being good enough for this level. That's why he barely gets a kick here. 

 

Nobody whatsoever doubts his work ethic, his fitness, his aggression and his willingness to bleed for the team. In a compact game where we're sitting in with a deep block and everyone else is in position, he can be let off the leash to just chase the ball like a dog at the park and that's where he shines. Games like "THAT" match at Anfield where all of foxestalk acted like he was the second coming of Ngolo Kante, he didn't need positional awareness or any tactical sense because the rest of the team was set up to condense the field and slow Liverpool down, freeing Hamza up to just charge after the ball and destroy. It was great. 

 

The problem is, we don't defend like that most of the time. We want to be on the front foot, so a lot of the work our defensive midfielder does is just holding position like a rugby union full back, ready to mop up the ball, recycle, stop counter attacks and keep us on the front foot. Hamza doesn't do that stuff well because he's too often charging off after the ball round the pitch or hovering in spaces that make no real sense because he looks like he doesn't know where to be. 

 

It doesn't have to be about "slating" the lad, there's a lot to like about Hamza and its all on top of the fact he seems to be a hard working, likeable and down to earth kid. But let's not pretend there's any reason he's not been in the team this year other than the fact he's just not good enough. 

 

Anyone thinking he's been mistreated and he's actually secretly better than Mendy isn't just a bit naive, they've totally lost the plot. 

 

I like Hamza, I do, but if we're debating whether or not he's better than Papy, sorry, that's just not a debate. 

Sensible post, we need to keep in mind the Mendy is 28 and has 250 odd senior games compare to Choudhury 23 with 70 odd, he has scope to develop.

 

I think they both have a place in the squad, and its about horses for courses in my view.