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Strokes

Getting brexit done!

By Strokes, in General Chat

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dsr-burnley

dsr-burnley

Posted
Posted
18 minutes ago, Fightforever said:

My biggest fear is that the economic fall out of Brexit and covid means that eventually there are mass cuts made to public services and we lose the NHS. Lets hope the "project fear" brigade are wrong.

If you're that frightened of the economic consequences of Brexit, I'd suggest you don't think about the economic consequences of Covid.:unsure:

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Fightforever

Fightforever

Posted
Posted (edited)
15 minutes ago, dsr-burnley said:

If you're that frightened of the economic consequences of Brexit, I'd suggest you don't think about the economic consequences of Covid.:unsure:

Yup the stimulus spending to keep the economy afloat during lockdown is sustained using loans I assume. Once we eventually have to pay the money back I assume the government will need to find the money from somewhere and the cuts would begin.

Edited by Fightforever
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bovril

bovril

Posted
Posted
1 hour ago, Fightforever said:

My biggest fear is that the economic fall out of Brexit and covid means that eventually there are mass cuts made to public services and we lose the NHS. Lets hope the "project fear" brigade are wrong.

I don't think the economic fallout will be as bad as some people think. There might even be some upsides to being outside the EU during the Covid recovery.

 

However I think the damage to the Union and to British society is irreversible which scares me more. 

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leicsmac

leicsmac

Posted
Posted
“It was the woman on Question Time that really did it for me. She was so familiar. There is someone like her in every queue, every coffee shop, outside every school in every parish council in the country. Middle-aged, middle-class, middle-brow, over-made-up, with her National Health face and weatherproof English expression of hurt righteousness, she’s Britannia’s mother-in-law. The camera closed in on her and she shouted: “All I want is my country back. Give me my country back.”
 
It was a heartfelt cry of real distress and the rest of the audience erupted in sympathetic applause, but I thought: “Back from what? Back from where?”
 
Wanting the country back is the constant mantra of all the outies. Farage slurs it, Gove insinuates it. Of course I know what they mean. We all know what they mean. They mean back from Johnny Foreigner, back from the brink, back from the future, back-to-back, back to bosky hedges and dry stone walls and country lanes and church bells and warm beer and skittles and football rattles and cheery banter and clogs on cobbles. Back to vicars-and-tarts parties and Carry On fart jokes, back to Elgar and fudge and proper weather and herbaceous borders and cars called Morris. Back to victoria sponge and 22 yards to a wicket and 15 hands to a horse and 3ft to a yard and four fingers in a Kit Kat, back to gooseberries not avocados, back to deference and respect, to make do and mend and smiling bravely and biting your lip and suffering in silence and patronising foreigners with pity.
 
We all know what “getting our country back” means. It’s snorting a line of the most pernicious and debilitating Little English drug, nostalgia. The warm, crumbly, honey-coloured, collective “yesterday” with its fond belief that everything was better back then, that Britain (England, really) is a worse place now than it was at some foggy point in the past where we achieved peak Blighty. It’s the knowledge that the best of us have been and gone, that nothing we can build will be as lovely as a National Trust Georgian country house, no art will be as good as a Turner, no poem as wonderful as If, no writer a touch on Shakespeare or Dickens, nothing will grow as lovely as a cottage garden, no hero greater than Nelson, no politician better than Churchill, no view more throat-catching than the White Cliffs and that we will never manufacture anything as great as a Rolls-Royce or Flying Scotsman again.
 
The dream of Brexit isn’t that we might be able to make a brighter, new, energetic tomorrow, it’s a desire to shuffle back to a regret-curdled inward-looking yesterday. In the Brexit fantasy, the best we can hope for is to kick out all the work-all-hours foreigners and become caretakers to our own past in this self-congratulatory island of moaning and pomposity.
 
And if you think that’s an exaggeration of the Brexit position, then just listen to the language they use: “We are a nation of inventors and entrepreneurs, we want to put the great back in Britain, the great engineers, the great manufacturers.” This is all the expression of a sentimental nostalgia. In the Brexiteer’s mind’s eye is the old Pathé newsreel of Donald Campbell, of John Logie Baird with his television, Barnes Wallis and his bouncing bomb, and Robert Baden-Powell inventing boy scouts in his shed.
 
All we need, their argument goes, is to be free of the humourless Germans and spoilsport French and all their collective liberalism and reality. There is a concomitant hope that if we manage to back out of Europe, then we’ll get back to the bowler-hatted 1950s and the Commonwealth will hold pageants, fireworks displays and beg to be back in the Queen Empress’s good books again. Then New Zealand will sacrifice a thousand lambs, Ghana will ask if it can go back to being called the Gold Coast and Britain will resume hand-making Land Rovers and top hats and Sheffield plate teapots."
 
Is there an argument for Brexit that is progressive, rather than one that just looks back to when the UK could do it all on its own?

 

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leicsmac

leicsmac

Posted
Posted
1 minute ago, dsr-burnley said:

I wonder if the person that wrote that, has any sense of irony at all?

Neither side (for sadly, there are sides) is especially self-aware - the discourse on the matter on here over the last few years indicates that.

So, with that being (roughly) equal, I'm still curious about the practical benefits that will allow the UK to progress in various metrics as a nation-state. (This has probably been done to death on here already, but hey.)

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yorkie1999

yorkie1999

Posted
Posted
1 hour ago, bovril said:

I don't think the economic fallout will be as bad as some people think. There might even be some upsides to being outside the EU during the Covid recovery.

 

However I think the damage to the Union and to British society is irreversible which scares me more. 

Yes, one of them not having to fund the Greeks to retire at 50 while we carry on till 68, and another is that Brussels is no longer our capital. Time to create a new common market.

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Gordon the Great

Gordon the Great

Posted
Posted
7 hours ago, leicsmac said:
“It was the woman on Question Time that really did it for me. She was so familiar. There is someone like her in every queue, every coffee shop, outside every school in every parish council in the country. Middle-aged, middle-class, middle-brow, over-made-up, with her National Health face and weatherproof English expression of hurt righteousness, she’s Britannia’s mother-in-law. The camera closed in on her and she shouted: “All I want is my country back. Give me my country back.”
 
It was a heartfelt cry of real distress and the rest of the audience erupted in sympathetic applause, but I thought: “Back from what? Back from where?”
 
Wanting the country back is the constant mantra of all the outies. Farage slurs it, Gove insinuates it. Of course I know what they mean. We all know what they mean. They mean back from Johnny Foreigner, back from the brink, back from the future, back-to-back, back to bosky hedges and dry stone walls and country lanes and church bells and warm beer and skittles and football rattles and cheery banter and clogs on cobbles. Back to vicars-and-tarts parties and Carry On fart jokes, back to Elgar and fudge and proper weather and herbaceous borders and cars called Morris. Back to victoria sponge and 22 yards to a wicket and 15 hands to a horse and 3ft to a yard and four fingers in a Kit Kat, back to gooseberries not avocados, back to deference and respect, to make do and mend and smiling bravely and biting your lip and suffering in silence and patronising foreigners with pity.
 
We all know what “getting our country back” means. It’s snorting a line of the most pernicious and debilitating Little English drug, nostalgia. The warm, crumbly, honey-coloured, collective “yesterday” with its fond belief that everything was better back then, that Britain (England, really) is a worse place now than it was at some foggy point in the past where we achieved peak Blighty. It’s the knowledge that the best of us have been and gone, that nothing we can build will be as lovely as a National Trust Georgian country house, no art will be as good as a Turner, no poem as wonderful as If, no writer a touch on Shakespeare or Dickens, nothing will grow as lovely as a cottage garden, no hero greater than Nelson, no politician better than Churchill, no view more throat-catching than the White Cliffs and that we will never manufacture anything as great as a Rolls-Royce or Flying Scotsman again.
 
The dream of Brexit isn’t that we might be able to make a brighter, new, energetic tomorrow, it’s a desire to shuffle back to a regret-curdled inward-looking yesterday. In the Brexit fantasy, the best we can hope for is to kick out all the work-all-hours foreigners and become caretakers to our own past in this self-congratulatory island of moaning and pomposity.
 
And if you think that’s an exaggeration of the Brexit position, then just listen to the language they use: “We are a nation of inventors and entrepreneurs, we want to put the great back in Britain, the great engineers, the great manufacturers.” This is all the expression of a sentimental nostalgia. In the Brexiteer’s mind’s eye is the old Pathé newsreel of Donald Campbell, of John Logie Baird with his television, Barnes Wallis and his bouncing bomb, and Robert Baden-Powell inventing boy scouts in his shed.
 
All we need, their argument goes, is to be free of the humourless Germans and spoilsport French and all their collective liberalism and reality. There is a concomitant hope that if we manage to back out of Europe, then we’ll get back to the bowler-hatted 1950s and the Commonwealth will hold pageants, fireworks displays and beg to be back in the Queen Empress’s good books again. Then New Zealand will sacrifice a thousand lambs, Ghana will ask if it can go back to being called the Gold Coast and Britain will resume hand-making Land Rovers and top hats and Sheffield plate teapots."
 
Is there an argument for Brexit that is progressive, rather than one that just looks back to when the UK could do it all on its own?

 

Believe it or not, I love this, I really do........but I am am a little concerned that someone has been opening my letters...................!

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Buce

Buce

Posted
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Posted
18 minutes ago, Strokes said:

What is it exactly you wanted to do today but can’t, that you could of done yesterday?

 

Call myself a citizen of a progressive nation.

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Countryfox

Countryfox

Posted
Posted
1 hour ago, Facecloth said:

So just wondering what everyone is up to today that they couldn't do yesterday due to the nasty EU?

 

33 minutes ago, Buce said:

 

Call myself a citizen of a progressive nation.

 

Smile ...   as I'm no longer a part of the nasty Fourth Reich ...     :D

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