Manchester City Found Guilty Of Almost All Charges

[MPH]

Just now, foxfanazer said:

I genuinely don't see any winners in this and fans of other teams getting giddy about it are maybe being a bit naive to think their clubs are squeaky clean. Basically all this does is make the last 15 years of English football null and void in one way or another. If they've cheated then everything they've been involved in is tainted, every team they've taken points from should effectively have those points back etc. 

 

It's a complete mess and a result of the joke ownership rules and FFP which was never fit for purpose. 

 

All in all I think it's a really sad time for football in this country and it's certainly not the game I fell in love with as a kid

 

we KNOW our club has fiddled their books for a few of the seasons with these mysterious sponsorship payments for companies set up with dodgy offices set up in some run down industrial estates..

 

 

but I think what is clear is that Man City’s rule breaking isn’t just on another level, it’s on another stratosphere. We were found guilty I believe on ONE charge. They have been found guilty on 114.

 

so the winners are those clubs that have lost out on silverware, players, league positions all because of the sheer scale of the cheating. I’m not so sure the guilty verdict will get them those titles but they now have a ruling that they can use to sue Man City with . Probably every team that’s been in the  prem in the last 18 years will try to sue them( we are allegedly suing them for £1bn!) but the actually successful claims could be just a handful .

 

so yeah, there’s definitely some winners in this.

[foxfanazer]

28 minutes ago, MPH said:

 

we KNOW our club has fiddled their books for a few of the seasons with these mysterious sponsorship payments for companies set up with dodgy offices set up in some run down industrial estates..

 

 

but I think what is clear is that Man City’s rule breaking isn’t just on another level, it’s on another stratosphere. We were found guilty I believe on ONE charge. They have been found guilty on 114.

 

so the winners are those clubs that have lost out on silverware, players, league positions all because of the sheer scale of the cheating. I’m not so sure the guilty verdict will get them those titles but they now have a ruling that they can use to sue Man City with . Probably every team that’s been in the  prem in the last 18 years will try to sue them( we are allegedly suing them for £1bn!) but the actually successful claims could be just a handful .

 

so yeah, there’s definitely some winners in this.

Financially maybe but it's no good to the fans of any of the clubs. Say if for some ludicrous reason Top managed to successfully sue them for £1bn, would that appease us as fans? We'd still be shit and stuck in league one with Russel Martin. Just with a significantly richer but no more savvy owner who has finally agreed to sell up 

 

Also I'm not saying they shouldn't be punished and that they aren't a special case compared to most. Just imo this isn't a  reason for gleeful celebration that some are making it out to be

Edited yesterday at 11:11 by foxfanazer

[Foxin_Mad]

To be honest if Leeds have a case, then we certainly have one, id argue we also have one again Everton. This is why PSR from day one was a stupid folly. 

[Phil Mitchell]

In a parallel universe where we do sue Man City, the club won’t see it anyway, it’s all going in KP’s pockets. Phil

[MPH]

40 minutes ago, Phil Mitchell said:

In a parallel universe where we do sue Man City, the club won’t see it anyway, it’s all going in KP’s pockets. Phil

 

depends who’s named as the claimant. They can try suing them but it’s Leicester City who missed out on a champions league place, not KP.

 

 

its actually possible KP are doing this as a marketing ploy to try help sell the club..

 

” if you buy Leicester, you might get a chunk of this money….”

[Phil Mitchell]

2 hours ago, MPH said:

 

depends who’s named as the claimant. They can try suing them but it’s Leicester City who missed out on a champions league place, not KP.

 

 

its actually possible KP are doing this as a marketing ploy to try help sell the club..

 

” if you buy Leicester, you might get a chunk of this money….”

Absolutely, proper dangling carrot. Phil

[teblin]

Not sure if I've put this before, but will all this just trigger the super league conversation again!

[foxfanazer]

31 minutes ago, teblin said:

Not sure if I've put this before, but will all this just trigger the super league conversation again!

Hope so. **** them all off 

[deep blue]

25 minutes ago, teblin said:

Not sure if I've put this before, but will all this just trigger the super league conversation again!

Hope it does, and I wish the super league had taken off when it was first mooted.

 

One caveat to that - even if a super league takes the fithy rich clubs away I have no confidence in the competency of the Premier League management ... plenty of opportunity for them to cock up the revamped Prem League again.

[foxile5]

This is a sorry, sorry mess and there really any right answer or outcome, is there?

 

I mean we've got a massive grievance in this. We're in League 1 and in financial peril. For 2 seasons we spent big to get Champions League football and arguably started the decline because of that. We were a few points out each time; we can point to their financial irregularities as a catalyst for that underperformance.

 

But Liverpool, Arsenal, Chelsea...they can all point to their lack of silverware. Relegated clubs. Managers losing jobs.

 

It's a right ****ing mess.

[foxile5]

1 minute ago, deep blue said:

Hope it does, and I wish the super league had taken off when it was first mooted.

I was DEAD against it at the time but, actually, it would have been the best outcome I think. **** off all the internationally favourable clubs to have their own little seedy league and we'd have had a decent national football league again.

[Sly]

It would be a bit rich coming from us, to try and sue Manchester City for financial irregularities. We would be chasing consequential losses and any liability will largely be capped. 

 

We tried to break the glass ceiling and failed. 
 

I think PSR became a convenient excuse for us trying to comply with the rules and the reality is, we signed a load of crap for lots of money on high wages. Then we couldn’t sign anymore, as King Power were struggling financially.
 

We were always going to fall at some point as we gambled and lost.
 

Getting Champions League really helped us become sustainable the first time …….. say hello to Musa, Hernandez, Zieler, Mendy, Kaputska, Slimani and Bolkiah. 

[trooky]

1 hour ago, Sly said:

It would be a bit rich coming from us, to try and sue Manchester City for financial irregularities. We would be chasing consequential losses and any liability will largely be capped. 

 

We tried to break the glass ceiling and failed. 
 

I think PSR became a convenient excuse for us trying to comply with the rules and the reality is, we signed a load of crap for lots of money on high wages. Then we couldn’t sign anymore, as King Power were struggling financially.
 

We were always going to fall at some point as we gambled and lost.
 

Getting Champions League really helped us become sustainable the first time …….. say hello to Musa, Hernandez, Zieler, Mendy, Kaputska, Slimani and Bolkiah. 

There are 2 types of charges here, the PSR charges that only seemed to be enforced around the 2023 season we were relegated. 

 

And Manchester City offences which are fraud and falsifying the accounts, lying about sponsors and saleries. 

 

We tried to comply, Man City cheated. 

 

 

[Sly]

Just now, trooky said:

There are 2 types of charges here, the PSR charges that only seemed to be enforced around the 2023 season we were relegated. 

 

And Manchester City offences which are fraud and falsifying the accounts, lying about sponsors and saleries. 

 

We tried to comply, Man City cheated. 

I still think the “we tried to comply”, was a convenient excuse for, we aren’t throwing any more money into this money pit. 
 

We’ve been losing a fortune for a long time.

 

I’m not convinced that if you scratch the surfaces of not just us, but all the other Premier League clubs with dodgy betting sites, random player exchanges etc, are whiter than white on this. 

[trooky]

1 hour ago, Sly said:

I still think the “we tried to comply”, was a convenient excuse for, we aren’t throwing any more money into this money pit. 
 

We’ve been losing a fortune for a long time.

 

I’m not convinced that if you scratch the surfaces of not just us, but all the other Premier League clubs with dodgy betting sites, random player exchanges etc, are whiter than white on this. 

I don't think that's the case, the rolling £105 million loss, with £90 million funded by owners started in 13/14.

 

The limit hasn't changed, but football finances have changed massively with TV revenue and saleries.

 

I think a few clubs were caught out in 22, Everton of cause failed in 21/22 but didn't get fined until 23/24.

 

At the end of 21/22 season Rodgers spoke about a squad rebuild and reset, and of cause we all know what happened after that. 

 

I agree this is the tip of the iceberg for all the big European clubs.

 

It will never be punished because most of it was exposed in 2018 and UEFA can't take action because their rules are time locked. 

[leicesterseddon]

4 hours ago, Sly said:

I think PSR became a convenient excuse for us trying to comply with the rules and the reality is, we signed a load of crap for lots of money on high wages. Then we couldn’t sign anymore, as King Power were struggling financially.
 

I agree. Sticking it to the man on PSR is just a displacement activity from our own failure

 

Our level of spending on player wages just a few years ago was completely out of whack and totally unsustainable 

 

Without FFP we would still be in this division, only in an (even) worse financial position than we are 

 

 

[BenTheFox]

11 hours ago, teblin said:

Not sure if I've put this before, but will all this just trigger the super league conversation again!

I am finding it pretty nauseating seeing the baying mobs of Man United, Liverpool, Arsenal, Chelsea and Tottenham fans calling for blood when their clubs also tried to form a breakaway super league, potentially undermining the entire English football pyramid, and received pretty much no punishment for it. 

Edited 10 hours ago by BenTheFox

[Finnegan]

20 minutes ago, BenTheFox said:

I am finding it pretty nauseating seeing the baying mobs of Man Untied, Liverpool, Arsenal, Chelsea and Tottenham fans calling for blood when their clubs also tried to form a breakaway super league, potentially undermining the entire English football pyramid, and received pretty much no punishment for it. 

 

I find the whole thing perverse. 

 

Mourinho was flapping his gob about how he deserves a bonus for the Premier Leagues he should have won with United. Like he was some plucky underdog being beaten out by City. 

 

He had like £100m Paul Pogba in his team at a time when Man City's record transfer was probably like £60m. 

 

Manchester United have spent eye wateringly grotesque amounts of money and the only difference really between them and Man City is that United sell more tee-shirts and credit cards and whatever the **** else. 

 

[BenTheFox]

9 minutes ago, Finnegan said:

 

I find the whole thing perverse. 

 

Mourinho was flapping his gob about how he deserves a bonus for the Premier Leagues he should have won with United. Like he was some plucky underdog being beaten out by City. 

 

He had like £100m Paul Pogba in his team at a time when Man City's record transfer was probably like £60m. 

 

Manchester United have spent eye wateringly grotesque amounts of money and the only difference really between them and Man City is that United sell more tee-shirts and credit cards and whatever the **** else. 

 

I've seen many people diminishing Pep Guardiola's achievements as though he now somehow isn't an elite manager. We all know that if he was Manchester United manager and was allowed to spend the same amount 'legitimately', they would have have been far more successful. 

[Gamble92]

22 hours ago, MPH said:

 

we KNOW our club has fiddled their books for a few of the seasons with these mysterious sponsorship payments for companies set up with dodgy offices set up in some run down industrial estates..

 

 

but I think what is clear is that Man City’s rule breaking isn’t just on another level, it’s on another stratosphere. We were found guilty I believe on ONE charge. They have been found guilty on 114.

 

so the winners are those clubs that have lost out on silverware, players, league positions all because of the sheer scale of the cheating. I’m not so sure the guilty verdict will get them those titles but they now have a ruling that they can use to sue Man City with . Probably every team that’s been in the  prem in the last 18 years will try to sue them( we are allegedly suing them for £1bn!) but the actually successful claims could be just a handful .

 

so yeah, there’s definitely some winners in this.

We haven’t been investigated for all of that yet

[Finnegan]

2 minutes ago, BenTheFox said:

I've seen many people diminishing Pep Guardiola's achievements as though he now somehow isn't an elite manager. We all know that if he was Manchester United manager and was allowed to spend the same amount 'legitimately', they would have have been far more successful. 

 

I've said it a bunch of times. I just don't really feel any anger for what Man City have done. I couldn't give a **** about their 115 charges. 

 

If it does genuinely surface in the coming weeks and months as all the details come out that they truly have spent vastly, vastly more than any of the other big six clubs could ever dream of then I'd feel differently. 

 

When Sarries got done in rugby I was delighted. They were blatantly and openly cheating, they were spending way beyond what anyone else was and it was just making a rigged and unfair system. 

 

But in football the system is already rigged and unfair. United, Arsenal and Liverpool are all allowed to spend what Man City have because of commercial revenue that has nothing to do with success. 

 

It's dumb. Massively dumb. Being angry about Man City but just shrugging and accepting that it's OK for Liverpool to spend over 100m on players over and over and not be angry about that is wild. 

 

[Rubbersoul]

I think football at the top level needs nuking and starting again. Too much money. 
 

I was looking at the transfers from the summer and absolute nothing players going for 40m-50m

[David Hankey]

Aren't the 'Cheetahs' in League Two yet?

[AKCJ]

Again, just so everyone knows...

 

These charges are from 2009 to 2018.

 

We finished above Man City once in this time. We also did not have a single season where finishing one place higher would have led to an increased reward (like Europe or avoiding relegation). The only somewhat viable claim is that we could have had an extra million or so for finishing one place higher.

[BenTheFox]

3 minutes ago, Finnegan said:

 

I've said it a bunch of times. I just don't really feel any anger for what Man City have done. I couldn't give a **** about their 115 charges. 

 

If it does genuinely surface in the coming weeks and months as all the details come out that they truly have spent vastly, vastly more than any of the other big six clubs could ever dream of then I'd feel differently. 

 

When Sarries got done in rugby I was delighted. They were blatantly and openly cheating, they were spending way beyond what anyone else was and it was just making a rigged and unfair system. 

 

But in football the system is already rigged and unfair. United, Arsenal and Liverpool are all allowed to spend what Man City have because of commercial revenue that has nothing to do with success. 

 

It's dumb. Massively dumb. Being angry about Man City but just shrugging and accepting that it's OK for Liverpool to spend over 100m on players over and over and not be angry about that is wild. 

 

It's funny because their punishment was a fine and a points deduction which resulted in automatic relegation. They were not stripped of the premiership titles they won for that period. I acknowledge that they never could have been stripped of their European titles because the salary cap is an English rugby requirement and is not applied across Europe. Their punishment was far lighter than what most people are demanding for Man City.